Season 3

Lt. Col. Nichole “Vapor” Ayers ’11 joins us from orbit! SUMMARY
From cadet to astronaut, she shares how the U.S. Air Force Academy prepared her for life aboard the International Space Station, the lessons space learned in the space program about leadership and how viewing Earth from 250 miles up re-shapes one's call to serve.
 
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COL. AYERS' TOP 10 LEADERSHIP TAKEAWAYS
 - Seeing Earth from space changes your perspective on leadership.
 - The fragility of Earth inspires a desire to protect it.
 - A lifelong dream of becoming an astronaut requires hard work and dedication.
 - Teamwork at the Air Force Academy prepared me for life in space.
 - Daily routines on the ISS are structured and focused on science and maintenance.
 - Astronauts are normal humans, not just heroes in space.
 - Quick thinking and calm leadership are crucial during space missions.
 - Community support is vital for success in unconventional paths.
 - Inspiring the next generation is a key part of my mission.
 - Curiosity and exploration should be fostered in young people.
 
CHAPTERS
00:00 Journey to the Stars: Becoming an Astronaut
03:32 Life Aboard the ISS: Daily Routines and Responsibilities
07:23 Lessons in Leadership: Quick Thinking in Space
10:54 Observations from Above: Humanity and Resilience
12:10 Inspiring the Next Generation: A Sense of Purpose
13:17 The Long Blue Line: Community and Support
 
 
ABOUT NICHOLE
BIO
U.S. Air Force Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers is a trailblazing pilot, leader, and astronaut whose journey began at the United States Air Force Academy, where she graduated in 2011 with a degree in mathematics. An accomplished F-22 Raptor pilot, Ayers is one of the few women ever to fly the world’s most advanced stealth fighter—and she’s one of even fewer to command them in formation for combat training missions.
Col. Ayers earned her wings through years of training and operational excellence, logging over 200 flight hours in combat and playing a critical role in advancing tactical aviation. Her exceptional performance led to her selection in 2021 by NASA as a member of Astronaut Group 23, an elite class of 10 chosen from among 12,000 applicants.
As a NASA astronaut candidate, Col. Ayers completed intensive training at Johnson Space Center, which included spacewalk preparation, robotics, survival training, systems operations, and Russian language. Now qualified for spaceflight, she stands on the threshold of a new chapter that led her to the International Space Station.
Throughout her career, Col. Ayers has exemplified the Academy's core values of Integrity First, Service Before Self, and Excellence in All We Do. Her journey from cadet to combat aviator to astronaut is a testament to resilience, determination, and a passion for pushing boundaries.
 
LEARN MORE ABOUT NICHOLE
NASA Astronaut Nichole Ayers
 
 
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TRANSCRIPT
SPEAKERS
Guest, Lt. Col. Nichole "Vapor" Ayers ’11  |  Host, Lt. Col. (ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99
 
NASA  00:00
Station, this is Houston. Are you ready for the event?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  00:05
Houston, Station, I'm ready for the event.
 
NASA
Air Force Academy, this is Mission Control, Houston. Please call Station for a voice check.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  00:13
Station, this is Lt. Col. Naviere Walkewicz. How do you hear me?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  00:17
Hi, ma'am. I've got you loud and clear. Welcome to the International Space Station.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  00:20
Welcome to a special presentation of the US, Air Force Academy, Association and Foundation’s, Long Blue Line Podcast Network. I'm Naviere Walkewicz, Class of ’99. I was honored recently to speak with a true pioneer, United States Air Force Academy graduate, accomplished fighter pilot, 2022 Young Alumni Excellence Award recipient and now NASA astronaut, Lieutenant Colonel Nicole “Vapor” Ayers, Class of 2011, Vapor joined us from the International Space Station orbiting about 250 miles above Earth. Her journey from Cadet to astronaut embodies the pursuit of excellence and the spirit of exploration that distinguishes the Long Blue Line. For this conversation Vapor and I explored what it means to be a human in the vastness of space, how one's perspective shifts when Earth shows up as a distant blue marble, and what her journey can tell us about courage, connection and the Future. Lieutenant Colonel Ayers, this is such an honor. So excited. Seeing Earth from space forever changes your perspective. How was the experience for you? And how has it changed the way you view your role as a leader?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  01:32
Yeah, you know, I think for everybody, the experience is slightly different. For me, seeing the earth from the Dragon window for the first time was one of the most amazing things I've ever seen. And then seeing the Earth every day from the cupola and then the lab window that we have here, you know, you don't see country or state lines on the Earth, right? There's not like each state has a different solid color, right? There's just geography and just terrain. And so you get to learn the world all over again in terms of colors and textures and geography and water. You know, there's so much water on this earth, and it's hard to put it into perspective until you're actually looking at the Earth, and it's, it's something that has really hit me, because the Earth is so fragile. You know, we see these beautiful auroras, we see thunderstorms, we see different natural disasters, and it's really kind of made me want to take better care of this earth. And you know, when I get home, I want to just do things a little bit better and just take that extra step, to take my make my part in taking good care of this earth.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  02:38
That makes amazing sense. And, you know, I think it takes us to kind of your path to becoming an astronaut. Can you walk us through what that was like?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  02:47
Yeah, sure. So, you know, I was, I've been saying that I wanted to be an astronaut since I was little kid. And, you know, I always had an affinity for space and for the sky. And growing up in the Shuttle era, you know, as soon as I learned that you could fly the shuttle be the pilot. I was like, “Ooh, that's what I want to do.” And so, the very serious little Nichole set my goals really high and started working towards that path. And, you know, grew up right there in Colorado Springs, watched the Air Force Academy graduation, you know, and the Thunderbirds fly over every year. And it just kind of seemed like a natural path for me to go to the Air Force Academy, become a pilot and try to pursue the astronaut dream from the pilot’s perspective. So you know, I worked really hard, set my goals really high, and never got bumped off that path and was able to apply and actually get selected. And now here I am talking to you from the International Space Station.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  03:36
And it's pretty incredible being able to see you weightless there, and you're here in its full glory. It's pretty amazing. Can you, talk about your time at the Air Force Academy? Specifically, what foundational experiences would you say have really kind of played a part with your life in space right now?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  03:54
Yeah you know, I think the Air Force Academy, for me, the biggest part was just being on teams. You know, I played volleyball there. And, you know, I would say every Squadron is its own little team. And you know, as a four degree, you're there with all of your classmates, and you're going through training sessions together. And so being on these teams in different environments, and some austere environments and high pressure situations, and learning how to take care of other people in those moments, I think, has been huge in my path to getting here. You know, those, all those words speak truth here on the International Space Station, you know, we're in an austere environment. Sometimes we're under pressure situations, and it's just a few of us up here working together with the ground to make this International Space Station stay in orbit, to execute all of the science and the maintenance and keep it running and continue to learn everything we possibly can, both about space and about Earth in order to inform how we do life on Earth and how we get to the moon and Mars.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  04:47
Thank you. So maybe, can you share with us what your daily routine aboard the ISS is like...
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  04:53
Yeah, you know, it's not unlike yours. Potentially. You know, our schedule is pretty set to the ground team figures out about, you know, what science and what maintenance needs to be done, and who's going to go do it. We are scheduled from about 7:30 in the morning to 7:30 in the evening, and we get, you know, two to two and a half hours of exercise time so that we can maintain our bone and muscle and cardiovascular health up here. And then when we're not working out, we're, like, I said, executing science. You know, I'm surrounded just here in this module, every single rack has some sort of payload or science experiment going on, so we just kind of follow the schedule. We work with the ground team to figure out where the things are that we need, and the procedures and all of that. But it's not unlike life on Earth...
 
Naviere Walkewicz  05:37
Maybe a little bit different. What's the biggest misconception people have about life on the ISS, you think? And what's something that surprised you while you're being there?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  05:48
Man, you know, I've been asked this question before. I'm not sure if I know the biggest misconception. You know, I think that often people kind of put astronauts up on a pedestal, but, you know, we're just humans who like to do, like the work that we do. We're really passionate about what we do. We're good teammates. So we're just normal humans, and it's not the most glamorous job, you know, we do, you know, often wear diapers, or we're working really hard, or things like that. So, you know, just normal humans up here. I think one of the things that surprised me the most, I'll see if I can do this without bumping the Astrobee off the wall here. But for me, it took my brain a while to, you know, get used to seeing people on the wall, or, you know, our treadmills on the wall, or seeing people upside down, and there's no up and down in space. And so it took a while for me to get used to that, and for my brain to kind of remap what I consider up, down, left and right in space. And you know that people are just floating, and we get a float every day, I can let go the mic and talk to you.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  06:46
So we have a lot of cadets and young officers that listen to us. What advice would you give them in the dream of following in your footsteps?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  06:56
Yeah, that's a great question. You know, I love to preach hard work and teamwork. You know, find something that you really enjoy doing. You know, NASA needs, I studied math, right? I'm a pilot, but we need doctors. We need scientists, we need engineers. So figure out what you really enjoy doing, work really hard at that thing, and then go find a team you can be on, and figure out how to take care of other people, and figure out how, how you mesh in this world, and how you can and thrive in these small environments or austere environments with other people. So I love to just say, you know, work hard, be a good teammate, and everything will work out in your favor. I think.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  07:30
Can you share if you've received any valuable insights or advice from other Air Force Academy grads who were astronauts?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  07:37
Oh, yeah, I think tons, is what I would say, you know, Eric Kjell, and specifically Nick and Roger, who just recently flew and came back, you know, I think that there's been a ton of advice just in terms of of how we do life here on the International Space Station and how, you know, we're going to continue to explore on the Moon and Mars, and how we can share our story, and how we can share all of the science that we're doing. But I think one of the most practical things that I got was from Nick during the handover, when we, we had a couple days up here together, and he said, “Don't forget, you're still squishy.” You know, we're surrounded by a bunch of metal up here. Nothing is very soft. And so if you, if you get moving too quick, or you get too confident, it's very easy to stub a toe or hit something. And so we're still just squishy humans. And you know, if you take that one step further metaphorically, I think, you know, we're still just humans, and we make mistakes, and that's okay, as long as you can bounce back, and as long as you're not going too fast when you hit a handrail too hard.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  08:31
Absolutely. Well, you talked a little bit about the austere environment. What do you hope your mission and your story inspiring the next generation of Academy grads, especially those who feel called to serve in bold and unconventional ways.
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  08:46
Yeah, you know, I think the bold and unconventional part really hits me, because, you know, growing up during the shuttle era, and then I was at the Air Force Academy when the last shuttle flight flew. And you know, as you grow up, you say you want to be an astronaut, people often say like, Wow, that's awesome. And then when you become an adult, sometimes you don't quite get the same response, you know, sometimes you get a laugh. And so, you know, I would say that even if people don't believe you, or they don't necessarily support what you want to do, if you've got a goal or a dream, just continue to, like I said, work hard at it, you know, put your nose to the grinder. Get really good at whatever it is that you want to go do, and don't let the naysayers get you. You know, there will always be someone there who thinks it's silly, but you will always find someone who supports you. My old commander, Robin, again, he was the one who supported me and got me here, and he said, “Are you silly?” Like, why would you ever think that's silly, or hesitate to tell me what you want to do? So, keep talking about your goals, keep working towards it. And yeah, like I said, maybe someday you could be up here with us.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  09:44
Absolutely bold and unconventional, for sure. And speaking of such space missions demand precision under pressure. Can you share a moment, whether in training or on the ISS where quick thinking and calm leadership made a difference for you?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  09:57
Yeah, definitely. I think that I.... Actually, a great example is our space walk that Anne McClain and I did about a month and a half ago. You know, right in the middle of the space walk, the priorities changed and the game plan changed. And if you were just an onlooker watching, sitting at home watching, you may not have even noticed that. And I think that's a huge testament to our ground team and our flight director, Deanna Trujillo, for the day, you know, her ability to lead that ground team and change the game plan on the fly, and then get those words up to us through some calm loss and some other hardships that we were working through, and then for us, for Anna and I, to work together, both just the two of us out outside the space station and the vacuum of space, but also us with the ground to make that all look very seamless. We're very proud of how that space walk went, and our ability to kind of change the plan on the fly, execute, come up with new ways of doing things, and figuring out how we're going to leave the station in a good state, and also achieve all those objectives. So think that was we're actually really proud of the way that we, you know, manage all of those changes, and hopefully to the onlooker like yourself. It looks seamless.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  11:04
Absolutely and it kind of talks a little bit to what you said earlier about, you know, seeing Earth from a different vantage point and wanting to protect it. I'd like to actually ask you more about that. So can you share, from your vantage point what you've observed about humanity and the resilience as you, as you look on it, from us, from our perspective here on Earth, and you being up there,
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  11:24
Yeah, you know, I think that one of the biggest things that, you know, I mentioned the natural disasters that we see and, you know, and I feel a sense of duty to photograph and to try to document the things that just humans endure on a daily basis. You know, I talked about thunderstorms or landslides, forest fires, all sorts of things. You know, we see it from such a different vantage point up here. And, you know, knowing that there are people down there who are trying to survive, and knowing that those people will survive, and that we have an entire community that's going to rally around those people in those instances. And you know, just trying to do our part from up here and give, you know, that unique vantage point and give as much data and as much help as we possibly can. I think that's one of the biggest things that our world does well, is, you know, helping each other when we're in need.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  12:09
And Lieutenant Colonel Ayres, maybe you can share what's been the impact of this mission on your sense of purpose, and how do you think it will shape your next chapter when you come back on Earth?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  12:22
This is a great question. I've done a lot of thinking about this, you know, you know, finally achieving your childhood dream. What's next? You know, what do you do next? And I think for me, the biggest thing that I want to continue to do is just inspire the next generation. You know, all those little kids who say they want to be astronauts, and then they get laughed at as adults. You know, I think that's it's so important to just foster that curiosity and foster that sense of exploration. And really, you know, encourage the next generation to go do what they're passionate about, because we will always need someone in that niche thing that you're passionate about. And so helping people get there is, is really what I want to do next. And, you know, helping the next youth get to their dreams and their goals and continue to just build this society that continues to explore and as you know, especially as we go to the moon and onto Mars and we commercialize low earth orbit, I think there's so much that we can do. And it's I feel, again, a sense of duty to help the next generation do that?
 
Naviere Walkewicz  13:21
Well, we talk about the next generation and the long blue line being enduring. Is there anything else you'd want to share with Air Force Academy grads in general?
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  13:30
Yeah, you know, I think it might be a dead horse that I'm beating at this point, but the teamwork is so important. You know, just, just take care of the people around you. Make sure that you're always looking out for each other. You know, the long blue line is a very special thing to be a part of. And, you know, like yourself, you know, I met you a couple years ago, and it feels like I could just go, you know, hang out with you, have dinner, and we could pick up like old friends. And that's what the long blue line is all about. You know, having friends all over the world who can help you. You know, I got to hang out with Nick Hague in space, another member of the long blue line who told me I was going to be squishy. You know, things like that are just the unique moments that we have as Academy grads. You know, there's always going to be someone there who supports you and who loves you and who wants to see you be successful,
 
Naviere Walkewicz  14:15
Wonderful. Thank you so much for this time. There's probably so many more questions we could ask you, but I think the biggest one is just, you know, we would leave you with it's such an honor and a privilege to see you out there. We're proud of everything that you're doing, and we can't wait to see more of what you're able to accomplish while you're in space and when you come back.
 
Lt. Col. Nichole Ayers  14:34
Thank you so much. Like I said, so excited to talk to you today and to just share the experience and also, you know, have a have an influence on the AOG. I'm excited that the AOG is interested in space and interested in all of us who are out here. You know, again, the Long Blue Line is a really cherished and unique group to be a part of. So honored and proud to be a part of that group, and excited that I got to share a little bit of what we do up here with you guys today.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  15:02
Thank you so much for the time. Naviere Walkewicz  Well, before I close, I'd like to share what happened after the podcast. My cell phone rang, and I had a call from government, and I said, “Who could be calling me?” Well, I answered, and wouldn't you know 250 miles above the Earth, Vapor Ayers was calling me on my cell phone just to say what an amazing conversation we had. What technology we have, that she sounded like she was next door. It was an incredible opportunity for us to talk a little bit more about the podcast and highlight what you might hear in an upcoming Checkpoints article. So for now, I'll sign off. I'm Naviere Walkewicz, Class of ’99. Thank you for listening. This has been a special presentation of the US, Air Force Academy, Association and Foundation’s Long Blue Line Podcast Network. You can listen to this and all our podcast network programming at LongBlueLinePodcast.org once more, that's LongBlueLinePodcast.org
 
NASA  16:03
Station, this is Houston. ACR, thank you. That concludes our event.
 
KEYWORDS
NASA, astronaut, International Space Station, Air Force Academy, leadership, resilience, teamwork, space exploration, inspiration, Earth
 
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association & Foundation
 
 
 

Season 3 of the Long Blue Leadership podcast is a wrap! From established national leaders to rising stars, this season features inspiring stories from U.S. Air Force Academy graduates.SUMMARYThis season's guests included Dr. Heather Wilson ’82, former Secretary of the Air Force; Dr. John Torres ’82, NBC News Senior Medical Correspondent; Maj. Gen. Thomas Sherman ’95, Vice Superintendent of the U.S. Air Force Academy, and 2nd Lt.  Wyatt Hendrickson ’24, NCAA wrestling champion.
 
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TAKEAWAYS
Leadership is about collecting tools over time.
Your identity is not defined by your profession.
Intentionality in actions leads to personal growth.
Leadership can be practiced at any level.
Admitting mistakes quickly is crucial for growth.
Respect and loyalty are earned through care.
Every moment is an opportunity to make an impact.
Legacy is built in real-time interactions.
Conversations can unlock deeper insights about leadership.
Sharing stories fosters connection and learning.
 
CHAPTERS
00:00 Celebrating leadership lessons from Season 3 03:07 Insights from Dr. Heather Wilson ’82 05:47 Chad Hennings ’88 on identity and leadership 08:55 Young leader Wyatt Hendrickson's ’24 journey 11:51 Jemal Singleton ’99, leading where you are 14:53 Emma Przybyslawski ’10 on leadership beyond the uniform 17:49 Dr. John Torres ’82, earning respect and loyalty 20:37 Maj. Gen. Thomas P. Sherman ’95 on trust, courage, and legacy 23:47 Looking ahead to Season 4
 
ABOUT OUR HOSTS
BIO's
LT. COL. (RET.) NAVIERE WALKEWICZ ’99
Senior Vice President, Engagement
With over two decades in leadership roles, my current focus at the Association of Graduates - U.S. Air Force Academy is fostering a robust network of 50,000+ alumni. This commitment involves igniting a culture of engagement and inclusivity, underpinned by a strong foundation in support of our Air Force Academy.
- BIO COPY CREDIT:  LINKEDIN.COM
MR. WYATT HORNSBY
Senior Vice President, Marketing & Communications | Executive Producer
Wyatt Hornsby is passionate about developing marketing and communications talent and cohesive, high-performance teams. He is senior vice president of marketing and communications at the Air Force Academy Foundation and the Association of Graduates. He leads the work of the foundation and alumni association marketing and communications division, while also coordinating with various Air Force Academy offices, including Public Affairs and Strategic Communications.
- BIO COPY CREDIT:  LINKEDIN.COM
 
 
CONNECT WITH THE LONG BLUE LEADERSHIP PODCAST NETWORK TEAM
Send your feedback or nominate a guest: socialmedia@usafa.org
Ted Robertson | Producer and Editor:  Ted.Robertson@USAFA.org 
Ryan Hall | Director:  Ryan.Hall@USAFA.org 
Bryan Grossman | Copy Editor:  Bryan.Grossman@USAFA.org
Wyatt Hornsby | Executive Producer:  Wyatt.Hornsby@USAFA.org 
 
 
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FULL TRANSCRIPT
SPEAKERS
Co-Hosts:  Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99  |  Mr. Wyatt Hornsby
 
Naviere Walkewicz  00:26
Welcome to our retrospective for Season 3. We’re celebrating the first three seasons of the Association & Foundation’s premier podcast and the countless leadership lessons shared by some of the most accomplished Air Force Academy grads.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  00:41
Naviere, in Season 3, we’ve showcased some amazing stories and takeaways that apply to life, both in and out of the military. From the start, Long Blue Leadership has given listeners an inside look at real experiences, insights and advice from seasoned leaders as well as those just beginning their journeys. These deep dives explore how leaders not only face challenges head on, but also find ways to inspire and empower those around them.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  01:06
These conversations are amazing. What really sets this podcast apart are how these leadership discussions consistently touch on teamwork, perseverance, humility, excellence and service before self.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  01:17
Well said, Naviere. And in this edition of Long Blue Leadership, we’re gonna respond to a few clips and share our own perspectives related to some of our favorite moments, and we’ll also preview what’s coming up in Season 4.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  01:30
Now Wyatt and I would be remiss if we didn’t share — listen, we could go on about every guest that’s on this podcast, because everyone is remarkable, but we’re just going to focus on a few of them. So let's jump right into some of our favorite moments from Season 3.
 
Wyatt Hornsby 
Let’s do it.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
All right. Well, this first clip is someone that you’re going to recognize: Dr. Heather Wilson, Class of ’82. What an amazing graduate. And you know, when we think about what she’s accomplished — she’s a Distinguished Graduate, secretary of the Air Force, I mean, going on into Congress — she is a mentor for many. And this particular clip, she actually is referring to someone who’s been a mentor for her and being able to make an impact in his life. So let’s take a listen.
 
Dr. Heather Wilson  02:12
My grandfather was an aviator. He was also a mechanic. He could use any tool. I mean, he was just amazing with his hands. And I had learned a new tool in school, and I took out a piece of graph paper, and I drew a curve, and I said, “Grandpa, do you think you could find the area under this curve?” And he said, “Well, I’d probably count up the squares and estimate from there on the graph paper.” And I then I showed him something new, and it was called calculus, and it was the first time in my life that I realized I had a tool that my grandfather didn’t have. He had a high school education and had gone into the RAF during the First World War, and he was a great mechanic and a really good man, but I realized that there were opportunities for me that maybe my grandfather never had.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  03:14
What an amazing conversation with her. What did you think about that comment about the tool?
 
Wyatt Hornsby  03:19
That's very, very moving. You can see just what her grandfather, what he meant to her, and just to think about those experiences and how they informed and influenced how Dr. Wilson has been a leader to so many in Congress, as secretary of the Air Force and now as president of the University of Texas, El Paso.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  03:38
Yes. And when you go back to that conversation, I think she talks about tools in a toolbox, and she relates it to her grandfather and her dad, I think, as well. But she talks about the toolbox almost serving as — you never know when you're going to need a tool. So as long as you collect tools over time, they can make a difference. And so she likens them to the people in your life and the people who serve with you and under you and above you. But if you start to recognize the tools that they have, you never know when they're going to make a difference. And in her case, she was actually able to provide a tool like calculus for her grandfather.
 
Wyatt Hornsby 
A great lesson.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
Yes, yes. So make sure you take a listen on that one.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  04:15
Well, Naviere, this next conversation I absolutely love — Chad Hennings, Class of 1988, who went on, I believe, to serve in the Gulf War, flew the A-10 before joining the Super Bowl-winning Dallas Cowboys. And I love this conversation. Chad talks in this conversation about who you are isn’t necessarily what you do. It comes from who you are from within. I just love this clip. Let’s listen to it.
 
Chad Hennings  04:41
One of the questions that I ask someone who is changing and transitioning in their careers, whether that be from professional athletics or from the military, I ask them, “Who are you?” You know, a lot of times they'll say, “I'm well, I'm Captain so-and-so,” or, “I'm a former F-16 fighter pilot,” or, “I’m a former running back.” I go, “That’s what you do. Who are you? What you do does not define who you are.” I mean, that's the thing that I think so many people need to grasp, is that their identity is not based on what they do. It's more of an inner pursuit.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  05:14
Well, I won't put you on the spotlight and ask you who you are, but I remember that conversation, and it was really quite a reflective one for me, because I remember, as he was sharing those things, I started thinking, “Well, who am I, you know, as a leader, etc.” So that was really meaningful.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  05:30
Indeed. I mean, all across our lives and careers, we do a lot of different things. We wear a lot of different hats at various points, and I think it’s hard, but I think it’s so meaningful to really reflect on your own personal values in determining really who you are from within. I just loved how Chad talked about that.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  05:50
Yes, that was just one of the lessons that he shared. And I think it really kind of goes back to understanding yourself and growing as a leader. So it’s certainly a wonderful conversation for those interested. Well, let’s take a visit to one of our younger graduates. Most recently, 2024 class, and his name is Wyatt Hendrickson, so another Wyatt here. Some might remember him as Captain America. I think he’s been called that lately, in the news, but known for just his accomplishments in the world of wrestling and what he’s continuing to go on, hopefully here in the Olympics. But this conversation really is about some real insightful moments that I think he’s had as a young leader, that he recognizes the importance of doing things for yourself. And some might first think, “Well, that sounds kind of selfish, right? You know, we're taught to be team members and team players and do things together.” But when we, when we listen to this clip, I think we understand why he talks about doing things for yourself. Let’s take a listen.
 
Wyatt Hendrickson  06:49
As a leader in at the Air Force Academy, I started going to these briefs, and I’m like, “You know, I’m not going to try to have the a bad mindset. I’m not going to show up here, just check a box. I’m going to show up here and try to take something from it.” So what I did, I bring like a notebook or a small little pamphlet, just to write notes. And everything you do, do it with intent. Don’t do it because you’re afraid of a bad result — you’re afraid of something here, there. Do it because you want to do it, and you have to decide you’re doing it for yourself.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  07:18
You know, what I really like about that clip is understanding that you have to do things for yourself and not others. And so I liken it — you know, we are parents, and at one time we are children. And so we probably did things. We do things as parents for your children. When you’re a child, you do things because you don’t want to make your parents unhappy, or you want to make your teacher proud or your coach proud. And I think he learned early as a leader that if you’re going to do something with intent, to do it for yourself. What do you think?
 
Wyatt Hornsby  07:44
That’s right. Being able to invest in yourself so that you can show up for others as well. And so I think when you really consider that, he’s really talking about a little bit of service before self within that as well. And I think it’s working out well for him. You know, he just pulled off, some say, the biggest upset in NCAA wrestling history. And I agree, we’ll hope that he gets to the Olympics. Just what a remarkable young leader and athlete.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  08:11
Yes, and what an exciting and engaging conversation that I hope you’ll take a listen to as well. There were some exciting moments in there that he experienced, I think. You know, with the president and, you know, just kind of reflective moments with his coach, but certainly a conversation that many will be engaged by.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  08:28
And when we talked to him, his life was very busy, and we just so appreciate him taking time to talk with you, Naviere.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
Yes, absolutely.
 
Wyatt Hornsby 
All right. Naviere, this next guest I absolutely love — Jemal Singleton, Class of 1999.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
Gold will shine.
 
Wyatt Hornsby 
That’s right, assistant head coach for the Philadelphia Eagles, also coach for running backs for the Eagles. And this was such a great conversation. We were you were able to go to Philadelphia and sit down with Jemal and really hear his story and something — I mean, the conversation was just full of great insights. But one thing that Jemal said that I absolutely loved was, no matter where you are in your life and career, lead where you are. You don’t have to have a big team or direct reports, just lead where you are. So let’s listen to that clip.
 
Jemal Singleton  09:17
I think the biggest thing that you can do is lead where you’re at, and it doesn’t matter where you’re at. “Oh, well, I'm not the CEO,” or, “Oh, I'm not the head coach,” or, “Oh, I'm not the commander.” So? Leadership comes in a million different ways. And I truly believe that you know kind of what you do with the little things, is how you do everything. And if, in your position, whatever it may be — maybe nobody even works for you — you can still lead from that position. You can lead from that spot. And I think that's it. Don't be afraid to step out. Don't be afraid to be a leader in your own mind. It's got to start there. At some point, you keep honing those skills and then maybe you are going to grow. And then, hey, you have three people working for you, but you then be a leader at that point. And it’s kind of like what I mentioned earlier, about be where your feet are; lead where your feet are at.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  10:09
What a great insight. And I think that is just so helpful for not only people who are earlier in their career, and maybe they want to be able to grow as a leader. But also for leaders as well, in terms of how they instill in the people who they're privileged to lead, how they can continue to grow and advance.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  10:30
Yes, what a great life lesson in general. I think sometimes we are so eyes forward on the next thing, that we forget to be our best at the present and the moment. And that was a really, I think, a key message that I took from that was, you know, when he says, lead where you are, you know, be fully present where you are, just like we are right now, reliving, kind of that moment with him. And so what an engaging and amazing conversation with Coach Jemal Singleton. Of course, being a ’99 grad, you'd expect that, but, you know?
 
Wyatt Hornsby  10:58
We wish him. We wish him all the best. What a run he's on right now. Congrats to the Eagles.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  11:03
Yes. And if I may just offer this: I did want to extend to the team with the Eagles — I mean, what a world class operation out there, to be able to invite us in and put us in their amazing studio to help us share the story that really goes beyond the football, right? It goes beyond the field and how they're doing things as leaders out there. So thank you so much for that amazing support. We really appreciate it. All right. This next clip, Wyatt, is someone that we know well. She is one of our past AOG board directors, Class of 2010, Emma Przybyslawski, also a Young Alumni Excellence Award winner for us, what a remarkable leader. You know, she served in the Air Force, in the special operations community, but also went on after the uniform to really kind of lead her team and her business. In this particular clip, she's talking about leadership outside of uniform. And I think it's important for our listeners to know that leadership comes in and outside of uniform, and so we want to make sure we highlight that. But this particular clip, she talks about getting to “no” as fast as you can — and that's an odd statement to hear, but I think it's really impactful.
 
Emma Przybyslawski  12:14
One of my key tenets is having the stomach to say, like, “Oof, this didn't work out the way that I wanted it to,” or, “Maybe we were wrong about that.” Step 1, right? Admitting the problem. Step 2 is then pivot, move on, let it go. Just let it go, and either take some great lessons learned from it — hopefully you do — or just bail on it and like, go on to something different. Get to no as fast as you can. Like, no is an OK answer, but man, let’s get there as fast as we can. Because the more time you iterate and waste on bad ideas that you don't know if they're bad yet, that they're going to be, the sooner you can get to no, the better off you are.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  12:59
I really like that, just because it's so different. I mean, it's a different perspective on being thoughtful. on resources and time and how you actually utilize all that as a leader and when you're making decisions that impact others. I just thought that was really insightful. What'd you get from it?
 
Wyatt Hornsby  13:16
I agree, and what I hear from that is integrity and discipline. No one likes to admit that they’re wrong. It’s not the most fun thing in the world, but what I heard Emma say was, “If we got something wrong, just admit it. Get there as quickly as possible, learn and move on.” So I love that leadership insight.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  13:33
Yes, and when you look through history and you think about, those greats, those innovators — but you know, over time, they failed because they failed to actually move forward or stop something that was no longer working. They just held on so tight. I think as a leader, it's important to recognize that. And her, as you know, such, I think, a young and enthusiastic and, you know, impactful leader realizing that it’s an important lesson I think we can all take.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  13:56
It’s easy to see, you know, when we hear Emma talk about leadership, it's easy to see how far she's come in life, and, you know, what she's been able to do.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  14:05
Yes, so make sure you listen to that. While she does talk about that outside of uniform, she does share some incredible stories while she was in the special operations community. I think our listeners will really enjoy learning some of that too.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  14:16
All right, Naviere, our next guest, Dr. John Torres, Class of 1982 — and that's a name that many of our listeners and viewers may be familiar with. Chief medical correspondent for NBC News. And I love this conversation. Dr. Torres was able to take time from his schedule and visit with us here in Wecker Hall. And really what he talked about, what I took away from this was that leaders earn respect and loyalty. They take care of their people, and they put their people really before themselves. So let's listen to this clip.
 
Dr. John Torres  14:47
Watching leaders and how they did things, both when I was here at the Academy and when I was in the Air Force and even through medical school, the doctors that were good and talked to people appropriately. The leaders that were good and they had the men and women following them because they wanted to follow them, versus following them because they had to follow them. And as you know, there's a huge difference there. And I tried to model myself after the ones who had people who followed them because they wanted to follow — they respected them. They earned that respect. They earned that loyalty. And to me, that was always an important thing. And so when I transitioned over to medicine, especially being a flight doc, I wanted them to do the things that medically were important for them because they wanted to, because they trusted me, and they understood that I was looking out for them and not just their career or not just their flying, but looking out for them and their families.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  15:32
I remember that conversation.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  15:35
Caring deeply about the person, and not necessarily what they — putting that before what they do.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  15:41
Exactly. That conversation went on because it was referencing the fact that, as a medical doctor in the service, you know, you had those that really wanted to fly like that was their calling. And when they had a medical issue arise, you know, Dr. Torres, because he led in the way that he did. He created that relationship and that trust, to be able to say, “This is what we're up against,” and, you know, to be able to make a leadership and a professional recommendation, and then that, you know, “I care about you as a person, so I'm gonna ask you to consider this,” even if it might be the hard decision that they'd have to make. And I think that that goes a long way for leaders, because sometimes we have to give bad news to our people.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  16:21
That's right, and really caring about those who were charged with leading and taking care of their best interests, sometimes having those tough conversations. But when we do that, when we authentically care about our people, they will respect us. They will trust and that's really what he was talking about. Powerful.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  16:43
I think we could probably both think about examples of leaders in our lives that maybe we didn't get the best news, but we always knew they had our best interests, and we would walk through fire for them.
 
Wyatt Hornsby 
That's right.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
Yes, what a great conversation with an amazing speaker. You'll have to take a listen to the entire conversation with Dr. Torres, because his was really incredible. And the fact that he actually almost left the Academy, but stayed because of survival training. So you make sure you listen to that. All right. Well, this last clip we're going to visit is, gosh, I still just got goose bumps thinking about the conversation with him. It's a recent conversation with Maj. Gen. Tom P. Sherman, Class of 1995, the current vice superintendent of the Air Force Academy. And I could go on and on about, you know, the way he inspires through his words, but this particular clip, Wyatt, was one where he talks about courage, right? And when he recognized a moment in time. This is from a conversation with his AOC, back when he was a cadet at the Air Force Academy, and he had a moment of clarity.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  17:45
We've both had the opportunity to see Gen. Sherman speak, and just an incredible speaker and presenter — really gets to know his audience. So let's listen.
 
Maj. Gen. Thomas P. Sherman  17:57
But I think really where the Foundation came in is where we started to talk about leadership. And you know, what I was asking him to do was to pull my rated recommendation form. So we had just submitted them, and I was asking him to pull my rated recommendation form. I didn't want to compete for it anymore. And so we started to talk about leadership. And he says, “You know, hey, Cadet Sherman, you need to understand that, you know, leadership in this Air Force is being the lead F-16 pilot on a bombing run. You know, putting iron on target.” And that's true. It's a very important part of leadership. It is a very important part of tactical operational leadership in this Air Force. So he's not wrong in that space, but I was looking at it from a different lens, and I was looking at it, I think, on a larger level. And what I don't think he realized is that 30 seconds before I walked into his office, he set me up for success. I just happened to be waiting outside the office, and all of a sudden I looked on his cork board, and somebody, and I don't know who it was, had pinned a note that was written to Airman Magazine by an airman first class. And this airman first class titled this, “I need a leader.” And this A1C felt so strongly about what they were feeling, and I have no idea who this person was, felt so strongly about it that they put pen to paper — and this would have been the fall of 1994 — and sent this into Airman Magazine, and it says, “I need a leader. Commissioning sources: Send us lieutenants that we can look up to that will hold us accountable when we do wrong, that will encourage us when we do well, that will be an example that we can look up to, that will care about us as human beings, because you are not sending them to us now. Air Force: I need a leader.” Like that 30 seconds just before I walked into his office, that changed my life. And it changed my life, because for me, at that moment, what I was getting ready to go ask my AOC to do what I was looking at inside myself like that became my charge.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  19:57
Naviere, I mean, as a graduate, how does that land with you?
 
Naviere Walkewicz  20:01
I have chill bumps right now, and it's not because it's cold in here, because it's not. I think you nailed it when you said he's someone who can really kind of inspire through his words. But you know, when I hear him say that, it makes me want to go back through the Academy all over again. I want to do it again to see if I can do it better. Because I want to be a leader for that airman and for anyone else that is serving alongside me, under me, etc. That's what I felt hearing that again.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  20:33
Yeah, and just from the whole conversation, I mean, that's really, I think that's the essence of Gen. Sherman's career, in my eyes, is that he has done everything he can to deliver or to develop as a leader and to be able to bring out the best in everyone who he has had the opportunity to lead and work with.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  20:51
One of my favorite moments in that conversation was about, you know, “What do you want your legacy to be?” You know, I think that was some kind of — that was maybe a way that I asked the question, and his answer was so unique, because he said, “You know, I don't really think about legacy, like, down the road.” He says — it's almost like he thinks about it in real time, and I'm paraphrasing, so you'll have to listen to the conversation. But he talked about, like, his legacy is when he makes an impact in every moment. So, like, this, you and I together, if I'm able to make an impact through our conversation, like, that's his legacy. And in off the screen, I didn't get to share this in our conversation, but my son, Arden, he's a cadet now, and when I told him I was going to be doing this podcast with Gen. Sherman, he had nothing but amazing — “Mom, I would walk through fire for him. He's so amazing. He's so inspiring.” And I shared that with Gen. Sherman, I said, “Well, you should know, sir, that you created a legacy with my son,” and it actually brought some emotion to him, and that that's who he is. I think that's who we want to be.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  21:52
Absolutely a remarkable leader and just an amazing episode. And hope that you all take the time to listen to it.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  22:00
Yes. So those were our highlights from Season 3. And like I said, we could go on about every one of our guests, because they're so impactful and amazing. And just — we take something from each of them.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  22:12
We did Naviere, and I want to just take a moment too, just to thank you for doing such a great job in Season 3. And just not asking questions, but just having conversations. And it's just easy to see that this just is kind of like a conversation over coffee, where you're just talking about leadership and really getting a sense of what their journey has been, whether it's been the good or the not so good, but just really finding out who they are authentically. So thank you, Naviere, just for leading those conversations.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  22:43
It's my great pleasure. I think some of the best work behind the scenes comes from this place of wanting to help share their story in a way that our listeners may not have ever heard before, and almost unlocking within them something that surprises themselves, about themselves, you know what I mean? Where they're actually like, “Wow, I'm sharing this,” and it's almost unlocking this new portal on leadership, on themselves. And so that's kind of how I always approach preparation for a conversation. And my goal is just to leave someone with something that really resonates with them.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  23:18
Well done, Naviere. And while we're at it, we're going to put Ted, our producer, our amazing producer, on the spot here. Ted, congratulations again on a great Season 3. And what are you — just any reflections that you want to share?
 
Ted Robertson  23:33
Loving watching Naviere grow and glow as a host — she's just my favorite person ever to work with, and thank all of you. This doesn't happen without a whole team committing time and resources and effort, eyes, ears, ideas. It doesn't happen without this group effort. It's a wonderful, wonderful place to be in. Speaking of places to be, you're going to talk about this a little later. Some listener feedback coming up next that Wyatt is going to tell you about. But we have the gift of a new studio that you're some of you are seeing for the first time inside of our new building that we can't wait for many of you to see. So thank you both for everything you do, your support, your encouragement and giving me this couple of minutes to share my thoughts with all of you.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
Thanks, Ted.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  24:23
Yeah. Thank you, Ted, again, great work, and we're just we're very grateful for all the heart and soul you put into Long Blue Leadership.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  24:31
Well, up next, Wyatt has some listener feedback to share with you, but before we do that, I'd like to take a moment and thank you for listening to Long Blue Leadership. This podcast publishes the first and third Tuesdays of the month in both audio and video, and is available on all your favorite podcast apps. Be sure to watch or listen to all episodes of Long Blue Leadership at longblueleadership.org. Once more, that's longblueleadership.org
 
Wyatt Hornsby  24:58
And a note I saw from Allison D. in reference to Naviere’s conversation, particularly with Emma Przybyslawski. And this highlights how hard Naviere has worked and how well she has done as host of Long Blue Leadership. And I'll start with Allison's note to Naviere, and then I'd like to add some thoughts of my own. From Allison: “Just wanted to do a quick shout out to let you know that I've been listening to your interview with Emma P. and I thought you did a phenomenal job. Emma's willingness to share her perspective in experiences in such an authentic way was a testament to her. But I also wanted you to know that while I was actively listening to her responses, I was also blown away by your ability to follow up with each response with an insightful and natural follow up question. My brain was still digesting her last response, and I don't know how you were able to digest and formulate such an interesting follow up question in such a short amount of time. Well done, Naviere.”
 
Naviere Walkewicz  25:58
I remember that comment. What a special moment to get that from Allison. Thanks for sharing that, Wyatt.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  26:05
Our pleasure, and thank you again, Naviere, for doing such a great job as our host.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  26:10
Well, Wyatt, let's talk about Season 4. It's coming out. Yes, some new things. Do you want to talk about kind of where we're in right now? What to expect?
 
Wyatt Hornsby  26:17
We're going to be having 13 episodes. Ten are going to be Long Blue Leadership, and then two are going to be really developmental focus, special presentations. Can't wait for that. And then, of course, we'll wrap up Season 4 with a retrospective, Naviere.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  26:31
Oh gosh, it's going to be amazing. I think what we've learned from the past seasons are people really enjoy hearing the stories from graduates that they can connect with — some transformational moments in their lives. But really excited. We kicked it off here at the end of Season 3 will be coming from our new studio here in Wecker Hall, so they'll get to see the studio and really hear the stories from our graduates. Those are really influential and key leaders in their fields.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  26:56
I can't wait. And some of our guests — they’ll include academics, warfighters, general officers, business leaders, scholars, diplomats, entrepreneurs, policymakers and others.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  27:08
Yes, and you mentioned it, that kind of leadership. Those two special episodes on leadership, this focus on leadership, we're actually going to go to experts in a field. Maybe they're published authors, but they are going to be some real experts that help our graduates and our listeners hone in on their leadership development. So it's really going to give them some tactical and tangible things that they can do to improve on their own leadership.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  27:30
I can't wait Naviere, an exciting new feature on leadership as we just continue to elevate our game. It's going to be really great.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  27:37
It's going to be great. It's going to — that focus on leadership will kick off in October with our second one in December. Wyatt and I want to thank you for joining us today. We can't wait to share the fourth season of Long Blue Leadership with you. Starting this September, you can expect more compelling stories from outstanding Air Force Academy graduates. We like to keep the podcast conversations thoughtful and aimed at telling our guests stories as we explore their personal leadership journeys, their philosophies and their styles. Season 4 promises to engage, inspire and empower. Whether you're an aspiring, emerging or seasoned leader, visit longblueleadership.org for more episodes and past seasons, or nominate a guest or send us your feedback at socialmedia@usafa.org. Long Blue Leadership is available on all your favorites podcast apps.
 
Wyatt Hornsby  28:30
And Naviere, this was such a great conversation, and I want to encourage you, if you've listened to these episodes or you've watched and you were particularly inspired, please share across your social media channels, share with your friends and colleagues and family members, because we really want these conversations to be for anyone who's interested in developing as a leader, regardless of what career pursuit they've taken.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  28:54
We like to say “like, subscribe and share.” There you go. Well, I'm Naviere Walkewicz.
 
Wyatt Hornsby 
And I'm Wyatt Hornsby.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
Until next time.
 
KEYWORDS
Leadership, Air Force Academy, mentorship, personal growth, teamwork, perseverance, service, identity, respect, legacy.
 
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association & Foundation
 
 

What does it take to lead at every level and shape the leaders of tomorrow?
SUMMARY
Long Blue Line podcast host, Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99 sat with Maj. Gen. Thomas P. Sherman ’95, the U.S. Air Force Academy’s vice superintendent, for a deep dive into leadership, humanity and building a world-class service academy. This episode is packed with wisdom for aspiring, emerging, and seasoned leaders alike.
 
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GEN. SHERMAN'S TOP 10 LEADERSHIP TAKEAWAYS
 - Leadership is a human experience - focus on connecting with and caring about people.
 - Love what you do and love the people you lead; passion inspires others to follow you.
 - Embrace failures and challenges as opportunities for personal growth and development.
 - Set the right culture and values within your team to build trust and mutual support.
 - Be present and engaged with your team, understanding their motivations and experiences.
 - Leadership is about more than rank or position - it's about earning genuine trust and respect.
 - Invest time in understanding different generations, cultural nuances, and individual perspectives.
 - Balance professional excellence with personal growth and life experiences.
 - Support your team's development by providing encouragement and holding them accountable.
 - Your legacy is built through individual interactions and the positive impact you have on people's lives.
 
CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction to Major General Thomas P. Sherman01:29 Choosing Leadership Over Flying07:23 The Impact of Mentorship and Values12:46 Heritage and Evolution of Security Forces17:43 Personal Growth in Aviano, Italy24:17 The Importance of Work-Life Balance29:50 Culminating Command Experience at Bagram42:25 The Role of Family in Leadership51:29 Continuous Self-Improvement as a Leader56:27 Embracing Failure as a Growth Opportunity01:00:06 Legacy and the Impact of Leadership
 
ABOUT GEN. SHERMAN
BIO
Maj. Gen. Thomas P. Sherman is the Vice Superintendent of the U.S. Air Force Academy in Colorado Springs, CO. He is serving as the chief operations officer to the Superintendent and overseeing the Academy’s blend of military training, academics, athletics, and character development for cadets.
Gen. Sherman commissioned in 1995 from the Academy with a Bachelor of Science in Political Science. He built a distinguished career as a security forces officer. He’s held command at nearly every level.
His key assignments include leadership of the 88th Air Base Wing at Wright-Patterson AFB and critical staff positions at the Pentagon.
In May 2024, Gen. Sherman was tapped to serve as the Academy's Vice Superintendent
 
CONNECT WITH GEN. SHERMAN
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TRANSCRIPT
SPEAKERS
Guest, Maj. Gen. Thomas P. Sherman ’95  |  Host, Lt. Col. (ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99
 
Naviere Walkewicz  00:00
Welcome to Long Blue Leadership, the podcast where we share insights on leadership through the lives and experiences of Air Force Academy graduates. I'm Naviere Walkewicz, Class of ’99 today. I'm joined by a leader whose career has taken him from the flight line to the halls of Congress and now back to the very institution that launched it all. Maj. Gen. Thomas P. Sherman currently serves as vice superintendent of the Air Force Academy, where he plays a critical role in guiding the development of our future officers and ensuring the Academy remains a world class institution for leadership, character and Day 1 readiness to win the future fight. A 1995 Academy graduate, Gen. Sherman has spent nearly three decades serving in key operational, strategic and command roles. He's led at every level, from squadron to wing command, and his assignments have included everything from nuclear security enterprise to homeland defense, policy development at the Pentagon, and legislative affairs at the highest levels of the Department of the Air Force. Prior to his role as vice superintendent, Gen. Sherman served in the Office of the Deputy Secretary of Defense, where he was a principal military assistant leading policy integration across joint staff, interagency services and combatant commands. He's perhaps best known in command circles for leading the 88th Air Base wing at Wright Patterson Air Force Base in Ohio, one of the largest and most complex wings in the Air Force, with a focus on people first, leadership and mission excellence. Gen. Sherman, welcome to Long Blue Leadership. We're so glad you're here too.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  01:32
It is great to be here. Thank you.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  01:33
We're excited and we're going to dive right in, because I think what is so special for our listeners is really hearing these moments that have changed your life. I'd like to start at the Academy. You turned down a pilot slot. You were rated, but said no.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  01:48
Well, actually it was a little bit before that. You know, it's kind of interesting, because that was the draw that brought me here, is I just had this incredible passion to want to fly, and I love flying, and I truly enjoyed it, especially through all the different airmanship programs and things like and things like that we had here. The experiences were fantastic. But, you know, as I was starting to learn more about myself going through the Academy, I was starting to feel my heart getting pulled in a direction of wanting to really lead people and really spend a lot of time working with the enlisted. And I think that came from a couple different areas. I think it was some really unique exposure that I got during my ops Air Force time, which I went to Ramstein Air Base in Germany, during ops, and just had our action officer that worked this, I think just did a phenomenal job. And I really started getting pulled to what was then called security police. That is actually when Laurie and I got together and started dating, because Laurie is here in Colorado Springs, but she grew up as an Air Force brat. My father-in-law is a retired Chief Master Sgt., and so there was a lot of mentorship that was taking place around dining room table when I was a young cadet. And I think one of the things that her parents really taught me was just the value of the enlisted force, and so I was feeling my heart really getting pulled. And so obviously, there's a conundrum. There's a conundrum on what were the root desires that brought me here — what were the things that I was learning as a cadet, my joy of flying, and also, particularly the culture at that time, was that that was really the job that you needed to aspire to be, that was the expectation of cadets. And so then to really kind of run counter to that strong current was really kind of a unique, you know, almost unnavigated area, right? And so to really kind of take the story out to its next level is that I'd really gotten to a point where talking with people there — we hadn't had the AMT program, but there were these NCOs that were kind of tangentially attached to cadet squadrons. And so I got a chance to talk to one of the master sergeants that was there who was a maintainer by background. And I was kind of pouring my heart out to him on, you know, what had I been talking to him with my now in-laws, about where was my heart pulling me? And so he said, ‘Give me just a second.’ And he picked up the phone, and he called my AOC and he goes, ‘Hey, you're gonna be there for a little while.’ And this was a Friday afternoon. He said, ‘I got a cadet that needs to come talk to you.’ And he hangs up the phone and he goes, ‘Now you go tell your AOC what you just told me.’ And so I ended up going to my AOCs office that day, and we had about a two-hour conversation about this. I sat down and really, kind of took the time to explain to him what was I feeling, And obviously, I really try to see the best in people. And so I think from a noble place, he was doing his best to convince me that I was making a grave mistake. And went on to talk to me about what his concerns were, the career field that I was looking at, things along those lines. And we can save that conversation for another time, but I think really where the foundation came in is where we started to talk about leadership. And you know, what I was asking him to do was to pull my rated recommendation form, so we had just submitted them, and I was asking him to pull my rated recommendation form. I didn't want to compete for it anymore. And so we started to talk about leadership. And he says, ‘Hey, Cadet Sherman, you need to understand that leadership in this Air Force is being the lead F-16 pilot on a bombing run, you know, putting iron on target.’ And that's true. It's a very important part of leadership. It is a very important part of tactical operational leadership in this Air Force. So he's not wrong in that space. But I was looking at it from a different lens, and I was looking at it, I think, on a larger level. And what I don't think he realized is that 30 seconds before I walked into his office, he set me up for success. I just happened to be waiting outside the office, and all of a sudden, I looked on his cork board, and somebody, and I don't know who it was, had pinned a note that was written to Airman Magazineby an airman first class. And this airman first class titled this, “I need a leader.” And this A1C felt so strongly about what they were feeling — and I have no idea who this person was — felt so strongly about it that they put pen to paper, and this would have been the fall of 1994, and sent this into Airman Magazine, and it says, “I need a leader.” Commissioning sources. ‘Send us lieutenants that we can look up to that will hold us accountable when we do wrong, that will encourage us when we do well, that will be an example that we can look up to, that will care about us as human beings, because you are not sending them to us now. Air Force, I need a leader.’ Like that 30 seconds just before I walked into his office — that changed my life, and it changed my life, because for me, at that moment, what I was getting ready to go ask my AOC to do, what I was looking at inside myself, that became my charge. And so as we spoke, you know, 20-year-old Cadet First Class Sherman — I might have been a 21-year-old at the time — Cadet First Class Sherman pushed back on my AOC, and I said, ‘Sir, I disagree.’ I said, ‘I want to be that guy. I want to be that guy that that A1c is asking for on your cork board outside, because that's leadership in this Air Force.’ And so, to his credit, he said, ‘Hey, I want you to go think about this over the weekend. You know, think about what you're doing. Come back to me on Monday. No questions asked. I'll pull it if you want me to.’ And I left there, and I remember feeling like, not like a weight had been lifted off my shoulder, but I almost felt like this sense of like, ‘Now I've got my purpose,’ because that little article has shaped me my entire career, and I mean to this day, and at a scale. You know, as a lieutenant, my scale is this big on what I'm affecting to help do and be what that A1C needs to a wing commander. I always keep it in the back of my head, and after all of these years, I am still thinking about, Am I doing right by that A1C that 31 years ago, felt so strongly about something that they wrote a note to Airman Magazine, and that became my charge.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  08:09
That is incredibly powerful. I'm a little bit without words, because I'm thinking about, first off, being brave enough to disagree with an AOC. I mean, I think that takes courage in showing your leadership there. Were you always like that? Have you always been someone that is steadfast in a decision and being able to kind of speak out?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  08:30
So I get that from my parents. And, you know, I grew up in Corona, California. My mom and dad are amazing people. And we didn't grow up with a lot of money, and we grew up from a pretty meager background, and my mom and dad had made a decision early on in their marriage, when they had my sister and I, that my mom was going to focus to make sure that Nancy and I got an education, and my dad was going to work as many jobs as he had to to put food on the table. And sometimes my dad was holding down three jobs to make sure that we had nutritious food to eat, and my mom was working miracles to make sure that we were fed well, but that also that she was dedicated and had the time to volunteer for things like PTA, being involved as a class volunteer, making sure that we were involved in things and had exposure to things that what they did was they also instilled in me this really strong blue collar work ethic. And it was this aspect of, if I just roll up my sleeves and put in the work, anything is possible. And so on that line, this young kid growing up with a West Coast father and an East Coast mother, and just this, really neat family background that things for me, that I believed in I would go after with all of my heart and soul. And so I found out about the Academy when I was 12 years old. And so, you know, when I at 12 years — we were going to a community event there in Corona, and there was an officer recruiter — Capt. Craig. was her name — and we started talking. She says, ‘Hey, did anybody talk to you about the Air Force Academy?’ And I said, ‘No, this sounds great.’ So from there, I just made this decision as a 12-year-old, and I worked all the way through junior high and high school to get here, because to go to your point like, ‘I made a decision, I'm gonna see this thing through.’
 
Naviere Walkewicz  10:30
Whoa. OK, so you knew you were going to the Academy before you graduated high school.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  10:35
Yes, in my mind, there was no other option.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  10:39
And so anyone in your family serve, or were you the first one in your family to serve?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  10:43
So I am the first officer and career member of the family. My dad was drafted and went to Vietnam in 1967 and stayed through Tet of 1968. I had an uncle, Harry Lee Schmidt, who was a C-47 loadmaster in World War II and Korea, and my grandfather was actually a part of the initial kind of what was the foundation of the OSS and the Navy doing beach recon on beaches in the South Pacific, prior to island hopping campaign and island landings. And so there was this real heritage of service, right? Just not career service. But even then, as a kid, I always had in my mind, ‘OK, one way or another, I'm going to serve, and if I do an enlistment and then go to college afterwards —' but I had this idea that, ‘OK, I'm going to serve,’ and then all of a sudden, this became this amazing conduit that got me here, right?
 
Naviere Walkewicz  11:38
And they also had ties to aviation. How did they feel about your decision, your family?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  11:43
It was interesting, because they knew how passionate I was about aviation growing up. I mean, we did not miss an air show at March Air Force Base, the Chino air show, which was planes of fame, which was all historic aircraft. I volunteered as a high school student to work there, and we helped restore airplanes with me and my friends. You know, it was interesting, because my parents were very supportive in ‘OK, where's your heart leading you? And, what makes you feel so strongly about this?’ Because when I first talked to him on the phone, I called him from Ramstein Air Base and said, ‘Hey, I think I know what I want to do in the Air Force. I want to go to security police. And my mom was like, ‘What's that? And, so, as time went by and I explained it, I think my parents probably all along knew that that was probably going to be a very good fit. And then after commissioning and at my first assignment, I think that they were certain of it, right? Yeah, they were absolutely certain.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  12:37
That is amazing. Well, I want to dive into this profession a bit, because it's interesting. You know, you've mentioned, when you came in, it was security police, and, security forces and you hear people saying defenders and peacekeepers. So there's this lineage and this heritage. Can you maybe talk a little bit about that and then maybe lead us into that next transformational moment that you might have had in this role?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  12:58
OK, I'm very proud of the fact that, you know, I am part of an ever decreasing group of folks that came in when we were still security police, and that was really still the peacekeeper days, because this was all kind of the follow on on the Cold War. The peacekeepers were our cold warriors and that was a huge part. Our defenders came in and really, that name started to really grow in 1997 when the name changed from security police to security forces, and we were actually going back to some of our heritage that was in Operation Safeside, which was the combat security police squadrons in Vietnam. So when you think about the courage that was displayed during the Tet Offensive at places like Tan Son Nhat that those were safe side warriors that were a part of these combat security police squadrons. And so the very — part of the lineage of the very beret, and flash that we have is actually a tip of the hat to the lighter blue berets, and that flash with the Falcon and the crossed runways that goes back, actually, to our Safeside heritage days. The beret goes back even farther than that. It goes back to Strategic Air Command, Elite Guard back in the 1950s. So it's this great lineage. And so, you know, for me, part of it was like when I got my first beret, wow, that meant something to me. And then, you know, as we then kind of transformed along the way, and this amazing career field grew, and the aspects of this air based ground defense, which was really, I would say, was kind of the draw that got me into wanting to go into security police, was I really liked this idea of, ‘How do we do base defense?’ The law enforcement side was intriguing to me, but it was based defense that just had me just had me captivated.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  14:44
And was that something that you found out early in your career? After you graduate the Academy, you're now in security police. Is that when you kind of realized, ‘This is where I want to go in, air, base, ground defense.’?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  14:54
It even happened at ops. So as we were spending time with the security police squadron, I ended up spending time with a captain who was heading up the Elite Guard, and there was an interaction we had as I was doing a ride along. He's like, ‘Hey, you need to come see me.’ And so I went and met up with him, and he took me around and introduced me to all of his airmen that were part of the guard. He knew something all about them. And then we went to his office and talked, and he had gone to Ranger School and Airborne and things like that, and said, ‘Hey, like, the future of the career field is actually us looking to the past.’ And really kind of got me fired up on what we call back then, air base ground defense. So when I got to McChord — McChord Air Force Base was my first duty station. And the great thing about going to AMC first is it AMC is a mobility — I mean, it is all about mobility and the operations associated with it. And so the first thing that that my task was as the second lieutenant in that squadron was, I was the air base ground defense flight commander. So that was, I mean — we would go out to Fort Lewis, and we would bivouac for days. And I had, you know, a 44 person team that was a base defense sector. I had specialized K-9 units heavy weapons. And back in those days, we had 81mm mortar teams and fire direction centers that we would set up. So I just got completely on board with the air base defense piece. And so that was that was very passionate for me, which then made the next step to Korea an absolutely logical next location, going to the wolf pack at Kunsan, not only getting a chance to then stand up Gwangju as a part of the first Air Expeditionary Unit to go back to Korea since the Korean War, but then doing the mobile reserve aspect of it. And it was just a great assignment.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  16:40
Wow. So you were right in from the very beginning. You got kind of just into it all.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  16:45
So when we go back, when you were talking to me about, ‘Hey, when you make your mind up...’ So I had this five-year plan built out. And, you know, my five-year plan was ‘OK, I'm gonna do my first assignment at the first opportunity to PCS. I need to go remote. I need to go to Korea. And then, OK, how can I get another overseas assignment after that? And then what do I need?’ So the thought was, “Let me get to as many match comms as I can, as fast as I can in my career, and use that as a place — OK, because I want to build my experience base out. Because even as a lieutenant and young captain, I didn't want to come across as a one-trick pony. So my thought was, “Let me just get as much as I could under my belt early on.’ And so after I left Kunsan, I ended up going to Aviano Air Base in Italy, which, for me, when you look at like those moments in life that are transformational, this was transformational on a different level. You know, some assignments you go to are very much professional growth assignments. This assignment, for me, was very much a personal growth assignment.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  17:52
OK, so tell me more.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  17:55
I mean, when you think about it, four years at USAFA, very uniquely focused on a plate that is overflowing with things that you need to get done. So you are, you're focused on, you know, everything from grades to military training to all of those things. And then I get to my first base, and I am just working, and I'm volunteering for everything, and we have got a heavy ops tempo of exercises and things like that. And my leadership was fantastic, because they were throwing me into every opportunity I could. And then, boom, I go to Korea, and that is a unique warfighting focused — and at Kunsan especially was heavily warfighting focused. So now all of a sudden I am spending really, when you think about it, the last almost seven years being uniquely focused on mission, right? And so I get to Aviano Air Base, Italy, and the first thing that happens is Operation Allied Force kicks off. So I get there in January, boom. Allied Force kicks off. I think it was in end of February, beginning of March. And wow, what? Again, what an amazing, mission focused experience. And then after we finished up Allied Force and the base returned back to more of its steady-state standpoint, it was the Italians that took me under their wings, that because I made a specific choice, because I grew up — my mom's side of the family are all Italian immigrants — and I was always at my Nonnie and Papa's house, and there was just a lot of that growing up, which is that whole, like, you know, West Coast dad, East Coast mom thing, but I didn't know, you know, my mom and her brothers never spoke Italian. And there was a lot of that, that thought back in those days that, you know, ‘Hey, we're here to be American, so we're going to learn English, and we're not going to speak, you know, the language that we came from,’ right? And so my mom and her brothers really never learned to speak Italian. And so my thought was, ‘Gosh, I grew up with this as such a strong part of my childhood that I need to put myself in a position where I can learn the language and start to kind of get an appreciation on the culture. Together.’ And so I specifically — and really lucked out on a location, but I was about 20 kilometers away from Aviano. I was in an amazing town. I was the only American living in the complex that I was in. So I was like, ‘If I'm going to learn, I need to just dive in the way that you do, in the way that I do, and just start learning.’ And so I ended up kind of building this support group of Italian families that all kind of took me under their wings.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  20:27
Wait, I have to ask you a question, because back when you're at the Academy, you said you spoke to your now in-laws. So was Laurie not a part of this?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  20:35
So Laurie and I, right. So that's an important part of the story. Laurie and I dated for two years while I was a cadet, and when I was in tech school, her and I made the very difficult decision — and as painful it was — to part ways, so her and I actually parted ways for a few years. I was single at the time. Laurie was still here in Colorado Springs, and I was getting a lot of assignments under my belt, which, to be honest with you, you know, in retrospect, it was very fortunate, because I may not have made the same assignment choices had I been married at the time. And because I wasn't married, there were no other variables that I needed to factor in, other than personal experience goals, right, that I wanted to play into, and so I could just put down whatever assignment I wanted, and that allowed me the opportunity to just focus on job. And while Laurie and I stayed in touch, and I stayed in touch with her parents over the years, I was in Aviano, and her and I were not together at that point,
 
Naviere Walkewicz  21:39
That makes sense. I was like, why were you alone in Italy?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  21:43
It's a fair question. But I also think that being single in that environment allowed me — and that's where I think it helped me develop as a person. And so there are a lot of, I think, really wonderful things that happened during that time, and that was because I was so uniquely mission focused. It was these, this amazing group of Italian friends together, that really kind of taught me about there, there's a time to relax, you know, there's a time to work, there's a time to relax, and there's also a real human need to enjoy life and enjoy time together, which is quintessentially Italian. And so, as my pool of this, these amazing people — that  by the way, for the last 25 years, we've been going to visit. It’s the same families that took me under their wings when I was a lieutenant, are the same families that were all tuning in as we were doing a live stream of me pinning on my second star. And so I've never been stationed anywhere else in my career where I felt more at home. And so I think this sense of like, ‘Wow. This like independently as my own person, this feels like home.’ And as time went by and I started to get an appreciation for actually things that were a part of my childhood. Because, you know, we would have these long, huge meals, we would spend four or five hours at the table as a family. And for me, this was all normal. Well, that was also a part of kind of normal Italian life and normal Italian culture. You're not going out to dinner with your friends unless you're investing at least three hours at the restaurant. But for me, this was all — this felt normal to me. And so it was about, you know, you don't need to eat your food in five minutes.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
So contrary to USAFA, by the way.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN
You know, you don't need to chew no more than seven times and swallow. So it was about experiencing that, and learning even just some things that became personal passions. Like, you know, how wine is made and why wine pairing matters, and how is this process? And so all of a sudden, this personal experience — and I think growing as a human being was taking place there, and I was maturing as a human being because I had gotten all of this phenomenal job experience under my belt, but this was where I was growing as a human being. And you know what's interesting, as time has gone by, I have noticed just how impactful that time was, because there are things that I've noticed, even as a senior officer, that I feel very strongly about, that I don't think I felt as strongly about as a junior officer, and it was because of that experience, and it was the aspect of when people are on leave, let's let them take leave. There is a part of the human experience that you need to enjoy time with people that you care about, because what it does is you're not slacking off from work. You're not leaving everybody hanging. What's happening is that, because you're taking some time to just enjoy life with people you care about, when you come back, the restorative effects that have taken place because you simply breathe and you enjoyed what it was that you were doing and whatever your passion was, you know, unencumbered, you could enjoy that. And we all realize that there are times, especially as you get into positions of authority, that, hey, they're going to need to call you periodically. But what was interesting is that, especially, I mean, I'll give an example as a wing commander. As a wing commander, despite realizing how important that mission is and how big Wright-Patt was, we, Laurie and I took leave, and we took two weeks of leave, and we went back to Italia and visited our friends and enjoyed life, because the culture helps us to slow down. But what it also did is I gave my staff some parameters. ‘Hey, here are the things that I think are important, like on a scale of one to 10. Here are the things that I think are an eight. So an eight or higher, call me. Don't text me.’ I said, ‘Physically call me, because I will answer the phone knowing it's for — and then you have my undivided attention.’ But what it also does is it means that my vice wing commander who is there, that I am empowering my vice wing commander and showing to everybody else I trust this leader to lead this wing in my absence. And if it's something that really needs my involvement, they'll get a hold of me. But I think our junior leaders need to see that at the senior most levels, that I can physically trust and emotionally trust my vice, my deputy, to hold things down while I'm gone, and that I'm not irreplaceable, and that if I did my job as a leader, I set the conditions that allowed the wing to thrive in my absence, and didn't mean that the wing had to hang on every decision I made or every word that I said, that I set the conditions that allowed them to be successful and fostered the leadership that allowed them to lead in my absence. And I felt great while I was gone, because I knew the people that we had there, and I knew the investment that we made in them. So that was kind of a long, you know, trip around this…
 
Naviere Walkewicz  27:26
I mean, I think it was so powerful that you kind of learned that about yourself in Italy. And then would you say that there was anyone that you saw emulating that? Or was it just something over time, you developed this realization that you need to enjoy life and you need to allow people the space to do so.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  27:43
So I would say the people that I was emulating in that aspect were a lot of the families that were there. I have been fortunate that I have worked for some commanders who, at different times in their life felt the same way. Conversely, I also worked for commanders that did not feel the same way. And, you know, an interesting case in point on something that on an experience I had in a command bill and after I had left Aviano — this is when Laurie and I were back together; we were married at this point. I had a group commander that was frustrated about me taking leave and called me every day at 1500; every day at 1500 I got a telephone call. And you know what that does is now all of a sudden, you're eating lunch, and the clock is getting closer to 1500 and you start to get that knot in your stomach and you're like, ‘OK, what are we going to talk about today?’ And so, unfortunately you don't see some of the same appreciation for that across the board. So how do we deal with it? The best thing that we deal with it is that that's where the buck stops. We don't pass it down to our people. So after I got the call from him, I didn't call back to the squadron. I got the call from him. We went through the call, we answered the questions, and I didn't then immediately turn around and call back to my ops officer who was running the Squadron at the time, and say, XYZ. And we just left it there, because at that point in time, the bucks got to stop it at that point. So I think that that's kind of the, you know, the alpha and the omega of learning and then also having your own personal resilience and courage to say, ‘I accept that the buck stops here, and I'm not going to let this roll downhill to my people.’
 
Naviere Walkewicz  29:41
That's an excellent leadership lesson, because I was going to ask you, ‘What does that look like, and how would you how would you handle that?’ And so you went right into that. Thank you so much for that. So what has it been like leading security forces — defenders? What's it been like? Has there been a moment in time where — a particular assignment or something's really stuck into your mind or into your heart, because it's just really affected you?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  30:05
Absolutely. I will tell you, as we go back, as we were kind of talking about decisions that you make in your youth, and that critical decision that I made in the fall of ’94 I mean, I have worked with some of the most amazing people I've worked in my life. I have gotten a chance to go to places I never thought that I would see. And so, when you kind of roll up, I would say it was my final squadron command, and I would say that that was a real culminating squadron command. So I commanded four squadrons, and we command early, and we command often, and there's a lot of responsibility that that's placed on us as young officers to command as a young officer. And so having the opportunity to command two times as a captain, or one time, you know, as a major-select, then as a major, then as a lieutenant colonel. So that culminating command would have been Bagram Airfield in Afghanistan in May of 2012 to May of 2013 and you know, it was interesting because all of my previous squadron commands had all been vested in either the contingency response or the kind of combat contingency environments. And it was almost like all of those were leading me to this moment. So let me just kind of set the conditions on what Bagram was like at that point in time. We had grown the squadron to about a 1,200-person squadron, huge squadron. And what we were also responsible for is we had taken over battle space ownership from the Army. So the Air Force was controlling 220 square miles of battle space throughout Parwan province, which is a huge. I mean, it's twice the size of Washington, D.C., if you want to try to give a comparison, more or less is fair to look at that level as just a huge amount of terrain in which our airmen were responsible from everything from humanitarian operations and goodwill outreach to engagements to literal kinetic action and combat in the battle space. And so a part of this culmination was, was an environment where as the defense force commander — as that squadron commander to them as a lieutenant colonel at that point — I mean how we are weaving ourselves into their lives, and how we are working with their section commanders, and how we're working and managing the value of our perimeter defenses with our teams that were going outside of the wire doing legitimate patrolling and engagement and things along those lines, was huge. And I think that that is an example. And when you look in the rearview mirror to say, ‘Gosh, now this, a lot of this makes sense, like all of these assignments, whether by design or whether by fate, somehow gave me an experience that at this moment, I needed it most.’ And I think, as I talk, we've really enjoyed being here with the cadets and talking to them about, how does a leader really develop trust, and how does trust really manifest itself? And so, through the time that we were there, and the engagement as their leader — not just the leader who's just simply circulating, because that's important, but they also need to see your decision making and your strategic thought. And how do you react under pressure? How are you reacting as we've got incoming in, and what do you do being the person in the joint defense operations center, helping to manage that, and how are you both taking care of people, and how are you managing mission? And they see that. And so I would say that the development of that level of trust, especially in an environment where you are literally dealing with high costs, is huge. And so I think there was one, situation that really rests on my heart that and I don't talk about this to give validation, but I think I talk about it on it's about how people connect, and why do I feel so strongly that leadership is a human experience, like this is a what we are doing as a human experience. And so I was retiring my chief. So I was asked by my chief at Bagram — this was some years later. He's out of the 105th Base Defense Squadron out of the New York Air National Guard, and him and I were a phenomenal team there. Dave Pritchard and I just made a great team. And so he was retiring, and asked me to come back and do his retirement. So we had done the retirement ceremony. We were at the VFW afterwards, having his after-party and so forth. And so I had gone into the bathroom for a comfort break and washed my hands and things like that. And I noticed, as I was kind of moving towards the bathroom, there was kind of a young man who was kind of floating. You know, floating around. And so I came out of the restroom as I was finished, and he was waiting there at the exit of the restroom for me, and kind of, you know, got in front of me, and he stood there, and he looked at me, and he goes, ‘Hey, sir, I just, I needed to let you know this, that I was one of the airmen in one of your patrols that got hit by an IED, and he said, your investment in us, and the words that you used and when you came to talk to us, and the faith that you had in us gave me the courage to go back outside of the wire when you asked us to go back outside.’ And so why that rests so heavy is when you think about what, what is the what is the con? The consequence there is that somebody believed in you so much that when you spoke to them and said the word, they were going to go back out and do it again, in spite of what had just happened to you. And I don't think there is any stronger level of trust that you can ask from somebody than to have one of those moments. And so that moment just resides very, very heavy on my soul, because I think it puts into real, tangible context, what is the responsibility of leadership? What is your responsibility of leadership?
 
Naviere Walkewicz  36:42
I'm letting that sit a little bit, because I can't even imagine the amount of feeling that you had first for him, the courage to share that with you. Because I'm sure that he really wanted to share that. I'm curious if you can remember perhaps, what he might have been referring to, like what you were sharing with the men and women there.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  37:02
So, you know, it was also a part of things that, in times after Bagram have really been used for me as a senior leader on why I reinforced the importance of values. And, this was one particular incident there that really comes to mind is, and I use this when I when I talk to people, because I again, it's the consequence, and it's why our responsibility as leaders to set the right conditions and culture and all of that is so incredibly valuable. And so I talked to people about a story about we had had a situation where we had some real destabilization in the battle space. There was a particular village that we were having some unique challenges with, and we were doing a lot of kind of battlefield shaping, and we were doing some particular village engagement, and the engagement just wasn't happening. And so we were now kind of starting to escalate our interaction with the village a little bit more and as we were doing that, we were now going to start doing more shaping operations. So it just so happens that one of these nights —this was in the late fall, early winter of 2012 — and we were sending one of our patrols outside to do some shaping and engagement operation there. But this was in the evening. This was a different aspect that we were working for this particular mission. And so mounted up that the airmen are ready to go. They're pushing outside, they're right on time, and everything is going according to plan, and they are getting close to what we call the objective rally point. So that was where they were going to rally up before they actually moved into the village after that. And so everything was going according to plan. And the only thing they needed to do before they got to the objective rally point was really kind of go down a small gully over a rise, and then they meet at their objective rally point at that point. And so teams are moving out. First truck over the rise, getting to the point. Second truck over, everything's going fine. Third truck over, fourth truck after that, BOOM, off goes the IED. And what had happened is, they were waiting for this opportunity, and they knew exactly what to do. And that is, if you hit the last truck in the movement, you've got three trucks that are gone ahead of time, and now we've got folks in a very precarious situation. And so what I talk to people about, when we talk about conditions and the real impact that a leader has, is I'll talk to them about who was in that truck, who was in that MRAP that we were sending down at that point in time. And inside that MRAP was the face of America. And the explosion was significant, and it did some considerable damage. It threw the engine out of it, penetrated the hole, ripped one of the doors off the side in the front. And so, you know, the truck commander was National Guard from, actually from Tennessee, and he had gotten injured, broken an arm because that door had peeled back. And as the door peeled back, his arm got caught and broke his arm. The driver, Asian American coming out of the state of California, active duty. He had injuries to his legs because of the penetration of the hole. We had a gunner up in the turret, African American female from the New York Air National Guard. She had a broken pelvis at the time, and she just stayed on the gun the entire time despite her injuries. We had our radio operator. European American female coming from the Midwest. She was actually Air Force Reserve. She had a case of TBI from the explosion, and she was still making calls on the radio. We had two of our riflemen in the back, both came from Hispanic heritage, one of them from Puerto Rican heritage, one of them from Mexican heritage. They were very fortunate that while they got tossed around the back and had some minor TBI issues, they were more or less bumps and bruises, and they were all by themselves. Yeah, because they were all alone, they were in the middle of Afghanistan, they had just gotten hit. And so for me, what's so important about that story is that if we did not set the right culture and the right values and the right expectations and be in a leader by example, and they were harassing each other on Bagram, and they were assaulting each other on Bagram, and they weren't respecting each other on Bagram, and they didn't care about each other on Bagram, they would have died out there that night. But they treated each other like a family, and they cared about each other like a family, and they took care of each other like a family that night, and they lived and they all came home. So for me, if we're going to talk about what is the true consequence of leadership — and I use consequence deliberately, because oftentimes that's used in a pejorative manner — but this is the true result of your actions, that if you don't set those conditions, then you are legitimately putting your people at risk. And so that whole experience at Bagram, and in so many ways that we all carry our scars and our bruises and things like that. I wouldn't trade that experience for the world, but that was tough. And I often describe it as a tale of two cities. You know, it was the best of times. It was the worst of times.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  42:34
I think a lot of times, when leaders go through experiences like that, they have some more fortunate than others, but a support network. And I would guess it would be your family. How has your family played a role in these moments in your life, in helping you as a leader?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  42:54
So I will say it's primarily my wife. I have got this wonderful support of parents and my in-laws and so forth. And what's been truly fortunate is how close I am with my in-laws. Because when Laurie and I were dating while I was a cadet, anytime I had an overnight or weekend pass, I was over at her mom and dad's house and so I think that being married to somebody that has truly known you from the beginning, you know, where, whether we got a training weekend going on, or something like that, or I'm working first BCT or whatnot, that Laurie was a unique part of all of these things. And I would say that it has been incredibly heartwarming to watch her interact with the cadets here, because it's fun, because her and I do everything together. And so as we're going to events, I'll have a group of cadets that I'm talking to, and then I'll look over and Laurie's surrounded by a group of cadets who are asking her just very insightful questions about our experiences together, and ‘Was it tough sending them away on deployments?’ Or how, you know, in those tough times, ‘How do you how do you keep your marriage together?’ Just really insightful questions to ask, but she has just been so central to everything that I do. And so going back a little bit and talking about, like the strength of our relationship and how much that helps, we actually needed to have that breakup period as horribly painful as that was, and wow, was I carrying a torch for her all of those years. I mean, I remember, you know, as time was going by, I would talk to my mom, and I'd be like, ‘Mom, I just wish that Laurie could see the man that I become.’ But we needed that time because oftentimes, and what we found in ourselves, we didn't know it at the time, because you're living in your environment and you can't see it, right? Is that in youth, things are often absolutes. And you often will get to a place where you're starting your marriage, your relationship is growing. And if you start to talk about marriage, there are things that we have found were absolutes for us. You know, certain things that we did, how we practiced our faith. Did we open up presents on Christmas Eve or Christmas Day, but the expectation was somebody was going to have to give up their particular tradition to conform to the tradition of one of the spouses. And in your youth, that seems reasonable, and I think we needed that time to be apart, having had that time together at such an important time in each of our lives here. But we needed that time apart, because I think we needed that frame of reference as we grew as people into adults. Grew as young adults. And now all of a sudden here I'm getting multiple assignments, and now being thrust into leadership positions with accountability and authority, and then coming back to that, all of a sudden, you're realizing, ‘Gosh, the world just isn't always in absolutes. And maybe a marriage doesn't have to be zero sum, but maybe a marriage can be positive sum.’ And do we really have to make somebody give up something that is important to them, that is a part of their identity? Because somehow you feel like you have to conform your marriage into one side or the other. And so, I think for us that was that was so incredibly important. So to kind of get to that story is that, you know, I left Aviano and I went to Al Dhafra. I was in Al Dhafra actually for September 11. It was my first squadron command, but it was a squadron command I wasn't expecting, because I came there as a chief of security forces for about a 70-person security forces flight as a part of the 763rd Expeditionary Air Refueling Squadron at Al Dhafra. And then all of a sudden, 9/11 happens, and we went from about 400 people on Al Dhafra to about 4,000. And you know, U-2s came in, ISR platforms came in. Everything changed. And all of a sudden, this 70-person security forces flight that I had grew into about a 350-person security forces squadron. And AFSET said, ‘Hey, Sherman, you built it, you keep it, and we'll replace you with a major when you leave.’ And I was a six-year captain, and so then finishing up that assignment, and I got picked up for — there was a point to that story — but it was about coming back, is that, hey, I got these new, unique experiences that grew me under my belt. And then I came back to do an AFIT program at Cal State San Bernardino. And that was the moment that brought Laurie and I back together.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
In what way?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN
And so, I had a health scare. Nobody knows what it was. We never figured it out. Doctors never figured it out. But it was one of those things, like, all of a sudden, I shotgun something out to everybody I knew. I said, ‘Hey, doctors are a little bit concerned, you know, keep me in your thoughts.’ And so Laurie, Laurie is like, ‘Holy cow, you can't just send a one liner and leave it at that.’ So she called my mom and dad and said, ‘What's his phone number?’ And so it started to turn into ‘Hey, give me all of your test results after you get it back.’ Then pretty soon we're talking a couple times a week, and then pretty soon we're talking every other day, and then we are talking every day. And the beauty of this was that we already knew each other, so we already knew what everybody's favorite color was — by the way, Laurie's is purple. We knew what music each other liked. We knew things about each other. And some of the things that actually drew us together when we were dating here was, you know, we had things like some common family traditions, like, you know, Italian fish on Christmas Eve and sitting around the table for hours and stuff like that were all things that we had in common. So we already knew that about each other. Now, her and I on the phone, we're getting into some real, like substantive discussions, children, faith. How do you how you raise children? How do you know, what are we going to do for different traditions? What happens if I have to take a remote; what does that mean? And so we were getting into these really, deep conversations. And, you know, I would come back from either class or then when I PCs to the security forces center out at Lackland, you know, I would come home from work, and this was in the old flip phone days where you had a battery that came off the back. So I would have one battery in the charger, and then I would have an earbud in, and I'd have the phone in my pocket. Yeah, and I'd come home and to call her, and we would just go throughout the evening. So I'm ironing BDUs at the time, shining my boots and stuff like that, and so, and we were just talking. And then we were just kind of like living life together. And, after that point, it became very clear that those two young people who sincerely cared about each other, now, each of us grew up and had experiences in a place that allowed us to really appreciate each other and really love each other. And you know, we were married just a little over a year after that. And it has been phenomenal, her support. And I think one of the great testaments to that was, 10 days after we got married, I went to Baghdad, but she's like, ‘I grew up in the Air Force. I know how this works. We're gonna move the house. I'll get the house put together.’ And she's also a professional in her own right, which is great. So she was working in a legal office here as a paralegal and legal assistant here in Colorado Springs, and has been a GS employee for the last 18-plus years. So what's great is she, too has her own aspect of service. What I love about it is that in the jobs that she's in and then the jobs that I'm in, we can talk shop, and then we cannot talk shop, right? And so she's the first person I go to if I have to ask a question, she's the first person that I'll go to say, ‘Hey, did I do that right? Or do I need to backtrack on that a little bit?’ Because she knows me, and she knows me completely, and that level of trust and love and faith that we have for each other has truly enabled me to be able to serve our airmen on a level that I don't think would have been possible without her.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  51:59
Would you say that she's had a role in your development as a leader, in the way that you lead.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  52:05
Oh, absolutely, absolutely, because, and I love it, because her experience as a brat and her dad as a chief gives her a very unique lens to look through. And so the advice that she gives me she can give me from her teenage self in some way, you know, from that experience, watching how her dad interacted with something or knowing her aspect about this. And then as she's developed professionally, working on the E-Ring at the Pentagon a couple different times, working for very senior leaders, knows how to navigate that space. So then I'll go to her for advice, like, ‘Hey, how did your boss handle something like this?’ ‘Well, let me tell you what, how we work through this...’ And so I would absolutely say that that Laurie has uniquely influenced and helped me to become the best version of myself that I can be.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  53:03
Wow. Well, I want to ask you a little bit about developing yourself as well, because one of the questions we like to ask is, what are you doing every day to make yourself a better leader? Can you share what that might be?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  53:17
I've said it a couple times during this: I truly believe that leadership is a human experience, so for me, it's about the interaction. And so oftentimes, advice that I've given to people — like there are amazing resources abound that can help people, give people leadership perspectives, and we can either learn it from history, or we can learn it through study. We can learn it through analysis. We can learn it through books. And I've always talked to people about use the external tools that help to grow you, but make sure that you're using it to influence the personality that you already have. Because oftentimes what happens is, is that people will have this really strong desire to say, “OK, I want to make sure that I do this right. And so in doing this right, let me make sure I've got my checklist, and so I'm going to greet them, I'm going to ask them how their family is, I'm going to ask them if the kid did all right in the baseball game. And I'm going to go through my checklist, and if I do that, I fulfill my leadership obligation.’ Now not everybody does, and I'm making generalities on but, but I think that there can oftentimes be the allure that when you are focusing on what may be the theory or the principle of the day, and not using it to supplement and grow and mature your personality, that there is a strong allure to want to wholesale replicate what it was that you learned, and you're doing it in a noble place. It's not nefarious. It's being done in a noble, genuine place. But there's that allure to say, ‘OK, good, I really like what I've learned. I'm going to do these things and step through.’ And so why I talk so much about the experience, and why I talk so much about the interaction, is that the more that you know the people that you may be influencing by just simply being there and understanding what that means. It means you're eternalizing the value of your presence. You're listening to their stories, and you're understanding for them, what are the things that are motivating them? What are the things that they value? Because each generation, each environment, each condition is going to require something a little bit different from you, and if you don't take the time to understand your environment or generation or cultural nuances or things like that on where you're at, then you are missing that opportunity to develop trust, where they start to believe in you as a person, and not just the rank and position that you hold, because they'll do the right thing for the rank and position that you hold. That's the caliber of people that we have in this Air Force of ours. They'll do the right thing. But if you transcend that in the fact that they believe in you wholeheartedly and trust you, oftentimes with their own lives, it means that you've invested something into them, where they truly know that you care. And that goes back to that A1C on the cork board that said, ‘I need somebody who cares about me as a person.’
 
Naviere Walkewicz  56:41
You know, as I think about what you've experienced through your career and the lessons you've learned, both professionally and personally, what would you say to yourself back then that you should be doing back then to get to where you're at now? Because we have listeners that are like, ‘What can I start planting today, that will bloom down the road?’
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  57:03
Absolutely. And so I think if I was to go back and put my arm around Cadet First Class Sherman, I think what I would do is — because it is, it is oftentimes easy to look in the crystal clear mirror of hindsight, right? But I think instead, what I would do is I would put my arm around him and say, ‘Keep following your heart and let the failures happen, because the failures are going to grow and let the stumbles happen and enjoy the triumphs with people and be appreciative for what got you there.’ And I think it would be more of the encouragement of like, ‘You have laid out a path for you take the path wherever it goes, the joy, the pain, the triumph, the failure, all of those things, because all of that helps to develop the leader.’ And oftentimes you want to go back and say, gosh, if I was going to talk to my previous self, then I would say, ‘Ah, don't do that one thing,’ right? But I'm looking at it saying that if I didn't do that one thing, then I'm not sure that I would be where I'm at at a time to make sure I didn't do that thing at a moment that was incredibly catastrophic. And so while we have this desire to want to prevent ourselves from the failure, I think that what we have to do is say you're going to fail and you need to fail, and it's going to sound — relish in the failure, because it is often emotionally troubling, especially those of us that come here because we are Type A perfectionist, and that's part of the draw of coming to this amazing place. Is there a certain personality traits that help us to be successful here, but not all of those personality traits make us uniquely successful in all situations outside, and so you've got to have that failure at some point in time. And the failure that you can get up and say, ‘OK, I did this. This happened. My soul is bruised. My ego is bruised. I may have to take a little bit of accountability for this. OK, now I need to have the courage to take the next step forward again.’ Because I could easily retreat back to a safe place, and I could become risk averse, and all that does is hurt the people around you. OK. I have to have the courage to breathe and take the step again and get back in there. So I would tell my — I don't think I would want to prevent myself from doing anything. I think even the growth that took place while Laurie and I were apart — and, like I said, that torch that I carried for her — I think if I had whispered in my ear and said, ‘Hey, just relax, you're gonna marry her.’ I think I needed that torch, because that in my own mind and my own emotion was me needing to become a better man, and so I think I needed to go through — like, sometimes you need the struggle, and sometimes the things that are most valuable are the things that you had to go through the struggle for, right? And I think that's where my blue collar ethics background comes in. It's like, I'm just going to roll up my sleeves and I'm going to work through the struggle.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  1:00:36
Wow. Well, we took a look back. I just want to ask you a question forward. So do you think about legacy? And what do you want your legacy to be? Is that something that plays in your mind as you wake up each morning or go to lead people?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  1:00:50
I think the way that I look at it is, I look at it in a in a different aspect, and the way that I look at it is in a very confined point to point. It's not about what is going to be Tom Sherman's legacy when he retires someday, but was that interaction that I had with somebody to give them some encouraging words when they fell down, did that matter to them at that moment? Because there are people for me in my failures that were commanders, that were leaders, that were mentors, that were senior enlisted, that, you know, grabbed that lieutenant by the arm and helped to lift me up. And their memories are etched in my fabric. And so I think that it's about that individual event that your legacy will live in the people in which you made a difference to them.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  1:01:49
Well, I'll share with you, I was telling my son — he's a cadet, a third-class cadet, actually, now he’s about to be a C2C — that I was doing this podcast with you, and he said, ‘What an incredible leader, Mom, he motivates me. He's so inspiring.’ So your legacy is already through my son—
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  1:02:05
Thank you! That means — thank you so much for sharing.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  1:02:10
—that you really made an impact. So we're going to get to your final thoughts here in a little bit. But before we do, I want to make sure that you know our podcasts publish on every second Tuesday of the month, and you can certainly listen to Gen. Sherman in any of our other podcasts on longblueleadership.org. So Gen. Sherman, what would you like to leave our listeners with today? This has been incredible, by the way. Thank you.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  1:02:32
I have truly enjoyed this, and it's just been — it was just wonderful having the conversation with you, and it's in real honor to be a part of this. I truly believe in what you're doing here.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  1:02:43
Thank you. It's my pleasure to help share your story and help inspire others. And is there anything we might leave with our listeners that that they can part with tonight?
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  1:02:51
I think, for me, you need to love what you do and love I think, is one of the most powerful words in language. And I don't just say the English language. I say in language because of the strength behind the meaning and how wide the meaning can be impactful. If you love what you do, people will feel that your very presence will make a difference. They'll feel that if you love what you do, then you're being, you know, internally, inspired by the love that you have for what you're being a part of, right? If you love and care about your people, they will follow you to the ends of the Earth, because they know the passion that you have and the belief that you have in them. So I think that as we go back to these things, we oftentimes look at the terms of courage and love may seem diametrically opposed, and I would attest that you can be most courageous and that your courage will be most effective only when it's buttressed by the love that you have in what you do and who you do it with.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  1:04:08
Thank you, sir, for that. Thank you for being on Long Blue Leadership.
 
MAJ. GEN. SHERMAN  1:04:11
Absolutely. Thank you. This was a wonderful time. It was a real honor.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  1:04:14
Thank you. Well, until next time, I'm Naviere Walkewicz. We'll see you on Long Blue Leadership.
 
 
KEYWORDS
Leadership, Air Force Academy, Major General Thomas P. Sherman, mentorship, personal growth, security forces, work-life balance, family support, continuous improvement, legacy
 
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association & Foundation
 
 
 
 

In this edition of Long Blue Leadership, we’re exploring the evolution and elevation of leadership with a leader who knows what it means to build champions in every sense of the word.SUMMARYJemal Singleton ’99 is a mentor, a motivator and has mastered the grind. From the military to NFL locker rooms, he has forged a path rooted in service, strength and success. Learn more about masterful game planning and get ready to be inspired! 
 
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COACH SINGLETON'S LEADERSHIP TAKEAWAYS
 - Coach Singleton emphasizes the importance of leading with conviction. - He learned to connect with people through immersive cultural experiences. - The Super Bowl victory was a culmination of focus and teamwork. - Growing up as a military brat shaped his adaptability and leadership. - Family dynamics played a crucial role in his development as a leader. - Discovering the Air Force Academy was a pivotal moment in his life. - Basic training taught him valuable lessons about overcoming fear. - His leadership style evolved through experiences at the Academy. - Transitioning from military to coaching was a significant decision. - Failures in his career have provided the greatest learning opportunities. - Success and failure are both essential for growth. - Belief in others can significantly impact their performance. - Understanding individual motivations is key to effective leadership. - Mentorship plays a crucial role in shaping leaders. - Building relationships is foundational to leadership success. - Balancing family and work is vital for personal fulfillment. - Grit and resilience are important traits in leadership. - Investing in personal growth enhances leadership effectiveness. - Daily routines help maintain focus and discipline. - Leadership can be demonstrated from any position. 
 
EPISODE CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction to Leadership Insights04:30 Jamal's Early Life and Military Influence08:00 Family Dynamics and Leadership Development11:35 Basic Training and Leadership Challenges14:52 Growth at the Air Force Academy18:58 Transitioning from Military to Coaching21:34 Navigating Career Decisions22:57 Facing Failures and Learning from Them26:18 Navigating Success and Failure27:38 The Power of Belief in Leadership29:58 Understanding Individual Motivations32:40 Influences and Inspirations in Leadership34:05 Building Relationships as a Leadership Foundation36:02 Balancing Family and Professional Life38:23 Lessons in Grit from Home40:38 Investing in Personal Growth42:41 Daily Routines for Effective Leadership44:36 Striving for Continuous Improvement47:27 Leading from Any Position49:14 Final Thoughts on Leadership and the Academy
 
ABOUT JEMAL
BIO
Jemal Singleton ’99, is a veteran coach with over 20 years of experience at the collegiate and professional levels. He is currently the Philadelphia Eagles' running backs/assistant head coach. Under his leadership, the Eagles have made four consecutive playoff runs, capturing two conference titles and the Super Bowl LIX Championship. From 2021–24, Philadelphia led the NFL in rushing touchdowns (108) and ranked among the top three in rushing yards per game (153.9) and yards per carry (4.7). Singleton helped three different running backs earn Pro Bowl honors during this span.
In 2024, Singleton coached a historic ground game led by Saquon Barkley, who rushed for 2,005 yards in the regular season and 2,504 total, earning AP NFL Offensive Player of the Year and first-team All-Pro honors. The Eagles set a league record with 3,866 team rushing yards.
Previously, Singleton helped guide D’Andre Swift (2023) and Miles Sanders (2022) to their first Pro Bowls, with both ranking in the top five in rushing yards. In 2021, Philadelphia led the league in both rushing yards and touchdowns.
Before joining the Eagles, Singleton coached running backs for the Bengals (2019–20), Raiders (2018), and Colts (2016–17), mentoring talents like Joe Mixon, Jalen Richard, and Frank Gore. His collegiate experience includes Arkansas (2015) and Oklahoma State (2011–14), where he coached standout backs such as Alex Collins and Joseph Randle.
Singleton began his coaching career at the Air Force Academy, his alma mater, spending nine years in various roles and helping the Falcons consistently rank among the top rushing teams in the nation. A former team captain and honorable mention All-WAC running back, Singleton led Air Force to consecutive 10-win seasons and a conference title.
A San Antonio native and son of a retired Air Force Sergeant, Singleton holds a degree in social sciences and lives with his wife, Jennifer. He has two daughters, Morgan and Mallory.
 - Bio excerpted from philadelphiaeagles.com  - Image credit:  Mr. Ryan Hall
 
 
CONNECT WITH JEMAL
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WITH OUR SPECIAL APPRECIATION TO THE EAGLES' PRODUCTION TEAM
Eagles Team (Center L-R):  JohnPaul Beattie | Wes Lauria | Kelleher |  Haley Mccullough | Alex Barson
(L) LBL Host, Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99 | (R) Guest, Jemal Singleton ’99
 - Image credit:  Mr. Ryan Hall
 
 
ALL PAST LBL EPISODES  |  ALL LBLPN PRODUCTIONS
AVAILABLE ON ALL MAJOR PODCAST PLATFORMS
 
 
 
TRANSCRIPT
SPEAKERS
GUEST:  Jemal Singleton ’99 | HOST:  Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99
 
Naviere Walkewicz 00:12
Welcome to Long Blue Leadership, the podcast where we share insights on leadership through the lives and experiences of Air Force Academy graduates. I’m Naviere Walkowicz, Class of ’99. I’m honored to join you from the NovaCare Complex, the training facility for the Super Bowl-champion Philadelphia Eagles, here in Pennsylvania. But I’m especially excited to bring you a conversation with my Air Force Academy classmate and friend, Jemal Singleton, the Eagles running backs and assistant head coach. Both on and off the field. Coach Singleton brings a wealth of leadership experience gleaned from his time in the U.S. Air Force and the NFL. This unique blend has made him a builder of high-performance teams, as well as a standout mentor and motivator. Jemal and I will dive into what it means to lead with conviction, to earn trust in high-pressure environments and to acquire the mindset needed to bring out the best in people, whether you’re on the gridiron, battlefield or in the boardroom. We’ll talk about how Coach Singleton learned to connect with people through immersive cultural experiences. We’ll talk about the coaches in his life who helped him see players for the people they’re becoming first. And we’ll discuss how a rocky start in professional football ultimately taught him patience and perseverance. So get ready to be inspired. Let’s talk leadership, game planning and more with Coach Jemal Singleton. Jemal, welcome to Long Blue Leadership, my friend.
 
Jemal Singleton
Oh, thank you so much for having me. I can’t tell you how awesome this is, to have the opportunity to be on this show that in the past couple years, some of the people that have sat in this chair have been unbelievable. I mean, yeah, Lt. Henderson, or, excuse me, Captain America, on the show, which was awesome. There’s two men that that I have great respect for with Gen. Gould and Gen. Clark. They were also on this show. So to have little old me sitting up here is really an amazing thing. I kind of feel like, with us, we’re like, the meme, the Paul Rudd meme. So this is a definite joy and honor for me to be here.
 
Naviere Walkewicz
Well, thank you so much for that. I feel like we blinked and 25 years went by, but here we are together again. So I’d like to take us right to the moment. I mean, most recently, Super Bowl champions. It was kind of a two-season road, right? Let’s talk about the moment maybe on the field where you knew you guys were about to win. Can you talk us through what that moment was like?
 
Jemal Singleton
I tell you, it’s one of those highs in life that I’ll obviously always remember. The greatest thing was really how the game played out. Not very often in the NFL, are you up, are you kind of having some backups in the game because of the parity in the league. So for us to be on the world’s biggest stage, the world’s biggest game for us in football, and to have a little bit of a moment, to just take a deep breath, look around the stands, look at the sidelines, and just take it all in, was unbelievable. So just to come away with that victory and have that opportunity, you don’t get that to sit back and look and say, “Oh my gosh, we just won.” You know, the game hadn’t ended, but it was kind of done at that point. So such an amazing feeling, such an amazing vibe, and just so many different storylines that led to that great finish. So just an unbelievable day.
 
Naviere Walkewicz
What was the leadership, coaching words that you shared with the team before the start of the game? Because you had come from a season where you got to that spot and you lost. What would you share with the team before this game?
 
Jemal Singleton
You know, I think— part of it is you had so many guys that had been to the previous Super Bowl with us and lost. So we had experienced getting to the pinnacle and not finishing. And really there wasn’t a whole lot that had to be said. You know, my role, I talk about ball security and protection, so I have a lot of presentations during the week that I give. But that week leading up, when we’re in New Orleans, there was a level of focus in the men’s eyes that was awesome, as a coach, to see. “Oh, they don't need to be hyped up. They don't need to be pushed. This team is exactly where it needs to be.” It was an amazing moment. So again, to have the Super Bowl win and that feeling— also to have kind of a coaching moment, to see a team so motivated and so dialed in, made it even more special.
 
Naviere Walkewicz
So you talk about it being a journey and coming to that moment of focus. Let’s talk about your journey. Let’s go back in time a little bit. Jemal. Who are you? What were you like as a kid?
Jemal Singleton
You know, I really had an interesting background growing up, and part of it was the military. My dad was in the Air Force, enlisted. He actually retired after 20 years, but met my mom when he was stationed in England. They moved to Turkey, and there’s where I enter the picture. Being born in Turkey, my mother wanted me to have a Turkish name. Wanted me to take the spelling of it, and it wasn’t Jemal originally. I think she had Ahmet Mustafa, was the name. And my father was like, “No, we’re not doing that.” So thanks to my dad for helping me. We stuck with Jemal. So Jemal David is my first names and really took the Turkish spelling, so J, E, M, A, L, that in Arabic, it is referred to as “the good looking one.” So hopefully I’m living up to my name a little bit. But that was the start. That was kind of the start and from there, just the journeys and the travels that we did through the military. So as a military brat, and I know there’s quite a few out there in this world, but moved a lot, jumped around. We went back to England. So that’s really my first memories. I don’t remember anything of Turkey, just know I was born there, but we went to England, and those were my first memories started. And that was kind of like home. My mom, being from there, had a lot of family and relatives over there, and that just kind of started to shape the rest of my life. And coaching kind of was very military, like we were moving. I was going to different places, and I think I was prepared for a lot of that movement stuff when I was a kid.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 05:54
Wow. So you were moving a lot. You talked about how that kind of parallels, and we’ll talk about this probably later in coaching — what that looks like — but as a military dependent, as a kid in the military, what was that like? How did that form you as maybe someone who adopts or adapts to things, and did you start to earn like early on, shape your leadership ways as a kid?
 
Jemal Singleton 06:15
I think so. I think for some brats, the lifestyle is not great. You know, you struggle. You’re moving every three years; you’re making new friends. But really, for me, I think it really shaped me. It allowed me to build a personality that I could be engaging, to build a personality and an athletic ability to play sports. And that’s usually how walking as the new kid in the room, I was able to build friendships, was through sports and through teams and all that. And like I said, every three years there was— we were moving and doing it, so I got to rehash that every three years of “OK, how do I make new friends? How do I compete in sports again?” But it really did help me, I think, to be able to exist in those environments and build those relationships as a kid. And I think it’s allowed the same thing even as an adult. I go back to some of those same ways of how I connected with people when I was a young man.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 07:03
I love that. And so was your family very active in your athletic pursuits when you were a child, or that kind of happened later in life?
 
Jemal Singleton 07:10
Absolutely. So I had an older brother that was living with us that also he was very active in sports. So He’s eight years older than me, so there’s a good separation, so I kind of got to see some things kind of play out before I ever got to them. But yeah, sports was always a part of our family, from everything from golf to football to track to basketball, all the things you could play. I mean, when you grow up overseas, on bases, you have to play all the sports if in order to put together a full team, there’s not that many people there. You need all hands on deck to be able to do that. So played a lot of sports growing up in Europe. So people, “Oh, when did you get into football?” I’ve been playing football my whole. Football my whole life, and it didn’t stop in Germany. It didn’t stop in England. It didn’t stop in the other places that we were able to live.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 07:47
So you talk about athletics being a big part of who you are. You mentioned that your mom and dad, like your dad gave her some feedback on the name she initially, initially wanted talk about that dynamic a little bit. How have your parents shaped you as who you are and as a leader?
 
Jemal Singleton 08:00
It’s just as unique as my upbringing, where we lived and where he moved, I think, is really the house that I lived in, you know, my mother being a very posh British lady, and then my dad from Louisiana down Baton Rouge, kind of coming from the south. It was very unique, not only culturally, just personality wise, you know. So I think I’d really took things from both of them. You know, I do kind of laugh. My mother was big on etiquette, so at the Academy, the etiquette training wasn’t a big deal for me. I already knew it. I’ve had my knuckles smacked with a spoon a couple times, but, uh, so just that— it was a really dynamic and even living in England and growing up, went to plays at these amazing theaters, and got to see kind of the art side. And then I really know the way to put it, but more the street sense of my father and just, you know, growing up, just kind of how he grew up, maybe rough neighborhood, and, you know, the military changed his life trajectory. And I think just having the most combinations of things is kind of who I am.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 08:54
So was it your father who then helped you see the Academy as the potential next step for you?
 
Jemal Singleton 08:59
Um, you know, you would think so, but it’s funny. My Academy story is a little bit different. It was when I got a recruiting letter from Air Force when I was playing high school ball. This is bad. I didn’t know the Academy existed. My dad was in the military travel, but I didn’t know. I definitely didn’t know that they played Division I college football and had a football team. So that was the first and I just remember my mom, like, oh. She was like, “Oh, the Air Force Academy.” Like, it was a big thing. And as crazy as my dad was always like, you know, if you go to the military, “I’d really like you to get your education and be an officer.” So both of my parents were kind of happy. And it wasn’t right away. I was like, “Yeah, this is definitely something I’m going to do.” It just kind of a process that went and the more I learned about I was like, what’s not to like? I’m going to have an opportunity to play Division I college football, which is something that’s big for me. I’m going to have a great career, be able to get be in the military when I graduate. I’m going to have a chance to get a great education while I’m at school. I was like, “OK, What’s the catch? What’s going on?” And it was something. That really kind of opened my eyes to that. And really was the main school that was recruiting me at the time. I had some Ivy Leagues because of grades, but, you know, I wanted to play, play at Air Force and put the bolts on my helmet.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 10:11
So what was it about— you said, you know, the fact that both your parents were really supportive, but was there a moment where you just knew, besides the fact that they were heavily recruiting you, was there something that intrinsically you just knew, like, I want to go here?
 
Jemal Singleton 10:22
You know, it’s funny. I’ve always been, ‘Hey, I’m going to make a decision and I’m going to go all in.’ And that was it. When I decided, hey, Air Force is where I'm going to school, that was it. And I wasn’t really highly recruited. I didn’t take a recruiting trip or anything. The first time I showed up at the Air Force Academy for Prep School was inprocessing. I didn’t need to see it. I had made up my mind. That’s where I was going, and that’s what I was doing. So it wasn’t anything that was going to hold me back from that. And gosh, I just look back and how thankful I am that as an 18-year-old kid, I was able to make a decision that was going to impact my life so greatly. And I just so thankful every day when I think about it.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 10:57
Gosh, I mean, I’m going back in time a little bit, and I’m picturing you now arriving at the Academy for the first time, and you went to the Prep School, right?
 
Jemal Singleton
Yes, ma’am.
 
Naviere Walkewicz
So let’s talk about that experience. I imagine it was a little bit of shell shock then having not actually stepped foot there before. What was that experience like for you?
 
Jemal Singleton 11:13
It was great, and I felt like I was prepared for the reason my dad and my brother had actually served in the Air Force as well. So he did a stint, enlisted as well. And I just remember it was almost like we’re sitting at the table talking football-type stuff. But they’re like, yeah, when you get to basic training, you have to do this. So they’re like, hyping me up for how hard and how tough basic training is going to be and what I got to do. And so part of me is like, “Well, take this challenge. I’m gonna go.” I’ve had these same conversations after football game. So I had two coaches, really, but it really felt I was somewhat prepared. I was prepared for the physical nature of it, the military lifestyle wasn’t something I wasn’t afraid of wearing a uniform or those type of thing. And it was, was a great it was a great opportunity for me. I was surrounded by some great people, both, you know, cadet candidates and you know, some of the officers and military training officers we had there, plus some of the prior enlisted members that go there. You know, the chance to learn from them. They’ve been in the Air Force, they’ve done it, and now they’re taking this new trail. So it was great. It was a great opportunity for me to kind of start my journey in the military and through leadership.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 12:15
Well, and early on, you’re identified as a leader. You were the Bravo Squadron commander for the Prep School. What was it like leading your peers, right? So you had, you just mentioned, you know, whether they came in as cadet candidates, through athletics, through prior enlisted members, they were your peers. How did you do that?
 
Jemal Singleton 12:30
Yeah, you know, I’ve kind of been like— the leadership stuff I’d always had surrounding football, you know, I’d been a team captain and those type and kind of knew how to lead in my voice in that realm. This was a total departure of that because really nobody in that building cared that I played football. And being the squadron commander at that point is like, “OK, well, how do I lead people that are really my peers?” As you mentioned, same age, same group. And then not only that, I’m leading some guys that have already done the Air Force. They have been in the Air Force for multiple years, are older. How do I do it? And that’s, I think that’s the first place that I really learned that, hey, you have to be able to lead people from where they’re at. You know, it’s becoming a part of who they are, connecting with them, because then that they’re not going to care how your leadership style is if they don’t feel that you care about them. And I really felt that, OK, I was going to lead by example, and then I was going to try and connect with as many people in the building as I possibly could, in a way beyond what I’ve done before in my lifetime. And so it was a great experience for me. It was tough, you know, some hard times, and spent some late nights, doing some things, preparing for inspections. But honestly, that being able to lead in a totally different environment than what I was used to, and for my peers was tremendous in my growth.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 13:43
Can you share an example of how that came about? Because, was it something you just adopted on the fly? Was it something you saw from another leader, perhaps your parent or a coach? But what helped you realize I can approach this the way I’ve always approached it on the field?
 
Jemal Singleton 13:57
Well, I just— right from the get go, like I could lead by example, on a football field, relatively easy. I just work hard. That’s it. Work hard and do some things. And I was fortunate enough to be a relatively good player that allowed me to make plays. So there’s, there’s that piece. Well, how can I make that conversion in a military environment, in a squadron with some non-athletes? And really there were some similarities. But as I go back to is like, OK, I was going to make friends on a football team because we work together. We’re doing the exact same experience. Well, I’m not going through the exact same experience as everybody in that building, a lot of different backgrounds, a lot of different thought processes and all that. So it really kind of hit me in the face. It’s like, you can’t lead the same and it that has helped me tremendously when it comes to coaching players, is, you know, I can’t coach every player the exact same way. And I’ve always felt I can stand in room and say, “This is my way. This is how I do it,” and I’m going to lose half of my room, whereas when I can learn to connect and learn, OK, what motivates this person? What gets them to reach their full potential? What do I have to do? And it’s individual for everyone, it helps. And I really kind of try to take that mode way back then. And I think there was some success. People didn’t hate me that I know of, but it was, it was just an unbelievable time of just learning a different type of leadership that allowed me to kind of grow and do some better things as I move forward
 
Naviere Walkewicz 15:21
That’s fascinating. So then you went on to the Air Force Academy, you did four years there, and talk about a little bit your own personal growth journey there as a leader, because you had some very quick wins, I think in the Prep School. Were there moments where you further grew at the Academy?
 
Jemal Singleton 15:37
Yeah. I mean, I think the Academy can test you. It truly can. And I think it’s sometimes in a very positive way that sets you up for success, but other ways where you’re going to fail. And I think part of the curriculum, part of that is you have to experience some of that failure in order to grow potentially. I mean. I bring up a story, and it does affect me. As a kid, when I was coming through there, first time you go to basic training, and I was like, “Yeah, I’m athletic. I’m a football player. I can do all this stuff.” Well, I get stuck in a tunnel, and it's basic training. You’re in there, and I’m in this tunnel with dirt, and I’m stuck. And I literally think “I’m about to die.” I’m stuck. My arms are caved in. I’ve got the rubber ducky yard, rubber M-16, and I’m holding my helmet, falling on my face and all. And I went through some life moments in that tunnel of dirt. And it’s funny to tell you, I was like, I was gonna die, and I had to really adjust my mindset. I had to get all the panic out of me. I had to breathe and then continue on. And it’s like an obstacle like that seems simple, seems very strong. I always looked at like— I’ve done tough things in my life, right. And some of it was set up by the Air Force Academy. But being able to overcome those things by taking a deep breath, assessing exactly what’s going on. “Let’s evaluate this issue, and let’s find the best way to do this.” And I think that has just set the stage for that. And it’s funny. Like said, a funny story as a cadet, funny now, I can laugh now, but it was— and but those little steps, those little situations, showed up all the time where the Academy— you truly get extended. You get pushed beyond your limits to see what your limits truly are, and whether that’s in water survival, whether that’s—
 
Naviere Walkewicz 17:28
Let’s go back to water survival for a moment, because I remember jumping off the 10-meter, having to swim underwater, just preparing, “Well, this might be it for me.” Let’s talk about that experience for you.
 
Jemal Singleton 17:39
I don’t know why all these great stories are where I think I’m gonna die, but there are multiple. So, I’m in the water. I’m not a great swimmer. Never been a great swimmer. I started out in basic swimming, all that good stuff. Well, I’m a little bit stocky, a little thick, so I don’t float well either. Part of the training was, we were learning how to get BTUs on, take my pants off, do the flip, get the flotation device. Well, jump in the deep end. And I start to remove my pants to be able to do that, not realizing I’ve sunk to the bottom of this pool. And I start to swim. I don’t have enough breath. I’m not going to make it to the top of this water. So I’m doing everything I possibly can. I’m like, the instructor sees me struggling. I finally get stopped, yanks me up and pulls me up there. And I’m like, “What am I doing? This is crazy.” But again, it’s basically facing a big fear. And it’s then I learned to swim better, and then I got a little bit better working, and I jumped off of the big 10-meter, 5-meter? 10-meter. We had to jump off of and all those things. But it’s funny: When  I look back, and it’s really this conversation is bringing out a lot of these memories of, you know, the little things, the little notches in time, of me doing something at the Academy that I would have never done anywhere else, being in basic training, going through a tunnel, almost drowning in water, survival in soaring, flying in a glider. My thought jumping out of an airplane when I took the jump program, all those little things are, like, just pile up and like, build your strength, your power, your stamina, all these amazing things that are— And then you throw in the fact of college football and athletics and bunch of the things that had to go on there. Man, pretty cool time.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 19:19
Well, I don’t know if my time was as fun, I’m just kidding. I think it’s pretty remarkable. And you talked about and then going into athletics, because your path is not very common, and we usually have a five-year commitment or 10 if you go on to pilot training. What was that like for you when we graduated then? And how did you get into this space?
 
Jemal Singleton 19:35
You know, I was one of those guys. I was pilot qualified when I got to the Academy, passed all the medical stuff and, somebody was like, “Hey, I want to fly. I'm going to be a pilot. Since I was up knee high to a grasshopper I’ve wanted to fly.” It wasn’t for me. It was something— it was an opportunity that presented itself again at the Academy. And I was like, “Oh man.” And so that became what I was going to do. I was going to fly. I was going to be a pilot. I fell in love with the A-10. I thought it was like me. It was built like me. Tank killer, and I was like those. And I remember, I’ll never forget I watched a show on it and there was a clip about it getting shot. And this A-10 had gotten its wing shot, all that, and still was capable to fly and land. I was like, “That's what I'm flying.” And that was it, and that was the plan. So I was going to be a pilot. Started introductory to flight training at the academy after I graduated, while I was also at the Prep School, went back there, and I was able to be one of the military training officers down there and coach with the football team. I fell in love with coaching. I did. I just, I fell head over heels for it, and I enjoyed flying. But there was just, there was a different feeling when I was on the field coaching. And I didn’t know that I had missed football as much until I was around it again. And I’ve always— I’ve told my daughter this: Find what you’re passionate about and do that, and if you do, you won’t work a day in your life. And so I had some tough, tough, tough decisions to make. You know, am I going to give up a pilot slot? Do you know how many people would die for this opportunity? They want to fly and probably can’t. So it was a hard process for me to make that decision. OK, you know what? I’m not flying, and part of was, there’s a 10-year commitment for it. I knew that probably wouldn’t get be able to coach at that point, and I just I couldn’t see myself without being a part of football. So took that jump, ended up giving up my pilot slot, got into public affairs, which was a great career, did some really cool things during my time in military, and was fortunate enough to get back to the Academy and get into the coaching world. So tough decision I had to make at that time to do it, but it kind of worked out for me, I think. Can’t complain too much, but yeah, just definitely a tough situation, a tough spot, and had to make a tough decision, kind of like what the Academy had trained me to do the whole time like, “Hey, there's going to be times where you're going to have to make a decision and jump all in.” And so I did.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 21:53
It sounds like it was a very important and monumental decision, and those are ones we don’t take lightly. How did you come to that decision? I’m sure you weren’t alone in getting to that point. So who did you lean into? Why did you lean into them? And ultimately, know that you had made the right decision?
 
Jemal Singleton 22:10
It started with my wife. I mean, obviously we had kind of had this roadmap planned forever of what life as a pilot and as a pilot’s wife was going to look like, and what things we were going to do. So it started there, and we had conversations after conversations after conversations. You know, I talked with Coach DeBerry, you know, Fisher DeBerry is an amazing man in my life, mentor of mine that I called and kind of talked about some of the things of, “OK, well, what if I do this?” Like, what if I don’t get back into coaching and just, you know, being able to have him as a sounding board there as well. But it was those people that were close to me just having those discussions of, “OK, is this something that I really want to do?” And at the end of the day, just with advice and prayer, I came to the thought that, “Hey, yeah, this is what I got to do.”
 
Naviere Walkewicz 22:57
I think that’s important to share that. You know, you did it in a way where you leaned into your network, your family, your foundation. I think that’s really important.
 
Jemal Singleton 23:06
Yeah, we can’t do these things alone. Sometimes we try, but these life decisions, you need help.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 23:10
Absolutely. So you got into coaching, and it seems like everything has kind of always been on an up for you, an up trajectory. Have you ever had failures other than almost dying in a tunnel?
 
Jemal Singleton 23:21
Yeah, I know those— the real stuff. This is what’s interesting about the coaching profession. And it’s— you’re going to move. And really, there’s two types of coaches, coaches that are fired, or coaches that are going to get fired. So it’s just part of the business. And not many people know this, but my first coaching job was with Fisher DeBerry in 2006 I separated from the Air Force in July. Well, Coach DeBerry retired that December. So was I basically— that was my first because had it not been for Coach Calhoun as he came in to retain me on staff, I would have been looking for work six months after I had just given up my military— you know, that lifestyle that I loved. And that was a thing too, is, you know, we were going to stay in the military forever. It’s just that, I love the lifestyle, but then an opportunity that I couldn’t pass up, coaching football, my alma mater came about, and so six months after, and what’s going on, I don’t have a job. That one was a scare. Kind of worked out. But then my first two years in the NFL, after my second year in the NFL, we’re fired fired. Like the staff is gone, “Find work, find a job, go somewhere else,” and you just start to realize that, “OK, this is part of it. This is what I have to do.” I'd kind of gone a pretty good streak where I'd have either avoided getting fired or did well enough to not get fired. But this hit me square in the face, and I was, “I’m in the NFL. Think this is kind of the epitome of what I'm trying to do.” And I’m told, “No, it’s over now.” So didn’t know where to go from that. Thought about going back to college. You know, same if I get into that world. But I was fortunate to stay in the NFL and keep grinding, as they say, and keep working. But there’s successes and there’s failures. And, I mean, I’ve had some ultimate highs and ultimate lows in this profession, and it’s—I’m just glad I’ve been equipped to kind of deal with it with my time at the Academy.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 25:14
Well, they say that in those moments, I think of great failure, there’s some forging of ourselves that happens. Can you talk through a little bit and whether it’s about being fired or any other time when you’ve experienced failure that has truly— you felt it was a part of how you’ve been shaped. How did you navigate that as a leader? Did it kind of shake you as a leader, questioning things about yourself? Or can you just talk about that?
 
Jemal Singleton 25:38
Yeah, I think as a leader, there’s got to be some sort of foundation that you have and what you build on. And that’s the main thing for me. You know, being a person of faith is something that I’ve always used as a foundation for me to rely on that when those times of trouble kind of arise. And I think as leaders, you understand that, you know, there’s wins and losses. I mean, I coach a profession that you’re basically judged by the scoreboard; that determines kind of your success or your failure. So it’s really, you know right up front, did we win or did we lose? Boom, it’s black and white. And those things happen all the time. But I do think some of the greatest lessons I’ve learned have been in the down times. You know, I’ve talked about been to two Super Bowls. I lost one, though, and that feeling after that game was unlike any other, and you kind of got to have some time to deal with it, you know, personally, and then you got to find a way. “OK, well, what do I got to do to move forward? How do I step—.” You can’t spend all day in that mindset not being positive. The success and failures that I’ve had in the NFL has allowed me, ultimately, to be at the point that I am, and I think also able to handle victory, just like you handle defeat, and that’s it’s been a pretty neat ride.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 26:51
For some of our leaders, when they are helping others navigate personal failures and loss, how do you coach them through that? What are some of the things you can help others in their navigation of that kind of time period.
 
Jemal Singleton 27:03
It really kind of leads me to this year. So Saquon Barkley, we know that he’s a phenomenal running back that I get the pleasure to coach. You know, just come from New York, his time at New York, and how it ended, there were some things and, you know, there was a part of me that was like, “OK, if I had been through what he had just went through, where would my mindset be?” Like, “What would I be thinking?” You know, first round draft pick, number two, second pick in the draft, all this stuff, had success, but not really, you know, major success. And it’s like, “So how are you feeling?” And so we had a meeting, and I remember telling him I wanted him to know exactly what I thought about him and his skills and his ability, and I let him know right off the bat that he's the best running back I’ve ever evaluated. Boom, that was a conversation, just us, and really didn’t know the impact that had whatsoever until he’s on a podcast, and it’s months later and all that. And he made the comment that, you know, when he came to Philly, you know, “My running back coach believed in me more than I believed in myself.” And I knew at that moment, you never know the one thing that you can say to a person, and it may be socially, it may be something— just some sort of inspiration, some sort of trust that can help them gain. And you just don’t know. And sometimes it’s a word, sometimes it’s a simple action. But I think when you can invest in people and invest in what they are truly about, and invest in them, that’s the first part. That’s the biggest hurdle of leadership there is because they know you care. They know that you’re doing things that’s in the best interest for them. And I think in leadership, that connection point is extremely important.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 28:42
So that’s an amazing story, and it was one on your team, such a critical player and component to, I think, the success of this team. But how do you do that for all of them that you come into contact with? I mean, it reminds me of the Academy, right? The best of the best going there, and how do you motivate the best of the best to that level of an individual investment.
 
Jemal Singleton 29:03
You have to know them. Like, you have to learn their personalities. Because what I did to motivate Saquon may not be the same thing to motivate my rookie or the next guy that’s coming up. It’s all different. And I go back to, I have to formulate leadership plans for me of how I’m going to address these players. Yeah, there's an ability thing, there's a football thing. It’s, “Hey, we can help you get better on this run or this path or these different things, fundamentally.” But it’s the other— it’s the mental part of the game that’s as big as anything. And the only way I can tap into that is to sometimes bare my soul, bare who I am, like, have honest and upfront conversations, to be able to show myself being vulnerable at times, because it allows them to know, “OK, this is a safe space. I can be vulnerable in here.” And that gives me insight to who they are, how they’re thinking. And when you have that, I think you can lean— they’ll do anything for you, and you’ll do anything for them. But that’s the biggest piece of leadership that I keep going back to. And it’s funny, and kind of not to segue a little bit, you know, one of the things in— I don’t know if you remember, so we were freshmen at the Air Force Academy. And Stephen R. Covey is talking to us, and it's the Seven Habits of Highly Effective People. So that’s Covey, and it’s this whole thing and the whole process. Now we’re just freshmen, you know, four-degrees. Well, fast forward. We’re talking 2023 we sign an undrafted free agent player by the name of Britain Covey. So Britain Covey is the grandson of Stephen Covey that wrote that book, and Britain's dad, also Steve, is also a leader in leadership, writes books, all those things. So full circle, I listened to his grandfather speak. Had to work with him on the football field and got to meet his dad, and his dad actually gave me a copy of his book that he’d written, with a nice note inside from that. But it’s like this leadership— and I bring all that up just to say because, you know and Trust and Inspire is a book that I lean on heavily, because it really fits my coaching style and my leadership style, and it talks about, hey, the transition from command-and-control leadership to trust-and-inspire leadership. And that book impacted me crazy. But it’s his father I heard speak, met through his son, boom, and now that same connection is helping me and coach. The values of trust and inspire and that type of leadership is me. Like, that’s the piece that I try to do. And you mentioned it, whether you’re in the field, the boardroom, whatever, I do think that we are in a world now where being able to trust your employees, being able to trust your players, be able to trust who’s working for you, and finding ways to inspire them allows them to reach their ultimate goal. And at the end of the day, I’m trying to help a person reach their full potential. So crazy.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 32:01
That is crazy. I’m still just gonna wrap my head around how it literally came full circle. Who else— are there other influencers in your life that have shaped you as a leader? I mean, that’s an incredible story and book to lean on. Obviously, talked about Fisher DeBerry, but anyone else that has really shaped you?
 
Jemal Singleton 32:16
Coaches have been a big part of my life, you know. And I go back to my high school coaches, my high school position coach, Glenn McClay, was a man of faith, strong and just unbelievable. With just that, I was a knucklehead as a young kid, being honest, I had this crazy haircut, all kind of— just coming from England show up in the San Antonio, like, “Who is this guy?” And he really taught me discipline, and he taught me how to work, and he taught me the importance of being a leader and how to lead and how you should respond if you are a leader. Was great. My defensive coordinator in high school, Don Lloyd, is actually— he was up just this past season, came up to a couple of games, so I keep in close contact with them, but those are probably two of the guys that started my change, my transition as a young high school, naive knucklehead, into maybe a mature young man. And then just to go from that program and be able to fall in Coach DeBerry’s lap and let him mold me and take me, and he’s just unbelievable that the way that he coached and he truly cared about me as a person, more than just a football player. That’s something I will never forget. And I was like, “You know, what if I could be half of the coach that Coach DeBerry was and with his players?” I mean, the number of lives that he impacted at the Academy during his tenure is unbelievable. But, you know, set me on an amazing path from that and just those guys, I mean, those guys— that pivotal parts of my life and my growth were there and showed me the way, and I’m just so thankful.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 33:51
Wow. I mean, everything that you’ve shared, it seems like we keep coming to this. You have really close relationships with the people that you connect with. It seems like with your coaches, with your players, is that the secret sauce to your leadership?
 
Jemal Singleton 34:05
It’s the foundation. I mean, there’s definitely that piece of “How do I connect out of those relationships?” And it's an old saying, you know. I mean, being an Academy guy, you know, I got quotes and phrases, you know, but, uh, but it is that my, my whole is— they don't care how much you know until they know how much you care. And I’ve used that my entire coaching career, and I’ve make it a like, “Hey, I’ve got to connect on the level with this.” Does it always work? No, I mean, not batting 1,000 but it’s worked a bunch, and I think that allows me to coach guys maybe harder sometimes, because they do know that I’ve kind of have their best interest in heart, but I gain that by showing my genuineness like, “This is not a farce. This is not something fake. I care about you. I want to know what's going on with your family. I want to get to know your family. I want to get to know you as a person.” And I just think that’s important. We’re all going through this journey of life together. Why wouldn’t we want to do it with close relationships to those that are near us? So that it is I’m trying to connect in any way possible. And also, going back to my I think because I’ve got interest in a lot of various things in different areas, I can usually find something. “OK, boom, we can click here. Let's start here, and we'll be able to build from that point from anything.” “Hey, he likes to play golf. Oh, I like—,” just a bunch of different things. Like, it’s been amazing to be able to try and find those points with a player to build on that. And it’s important. It really is.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 35:40
I mean, it sounds like you are certainly investing in the players. And it shows, right? I think you can see it in the translation on the field. Talk about what it's like outside of the building here, when you go home, what’s Jemal like at home? What’s home life? And how do you, I mean, lead as a father and a husband?
 
Jemal Singleton 36:01
I’ve had a great little saying I’ve been using recently. My daughter rodeos. So she rides horses, and she used to call it— “tough as bull” is the phrase. But my wife also grew up small-town Texas rodeo and riding horses, doing all that stuff, so she's part of that. But she used to compete professionally. She’s kind of given up that to help our daughter, like she’s training her. So I’m not even the best coach in my house. You know, my wife has got me beat. She’s working with this 11-year-old that’s killing it right now. But no, when I get home, I think that’s, there’s a leadership level there. I think being a father comes with responsibilities. Being a husband comes with the responsibilities. And I think that at the end of the day, I’m always going to try and be where my feet are, like be totally invested and committed into that. We talk at times, and it showed up. I think my wife— anything my wife posts out there. She’s got a post of me shoveling manure after the Super Bowl. So I was like— you want to know what humbles me? Horse manure humbles me. So we do have this farm. We do have horses, and do ride. And it’s a total departure from what I do day to day. So when I go home, and literally, my drive, I’m 30 minutes from the office, I get a time to decompress. When I’m going home, I get a time to get revved up when I’m coming in, but when I hit the gravel road that leads up to my house, like, that's my switch. “OK, I'm not in coach mode.” Now, you rarely turn that off, but I’m going into dad mode, I’m going into husband mode. I’m going in— that I have to try and be the best father and best husband I can possibly be. And my family deserves the same type of work ethic and hard work that I’m giving to my players at work, to the coaches at work. They deserve those same characteristics when I get home. So that’s a big part of trying to be home. And that means, you know, you can win a Super Bowl if you want, but you’re going to shovel, you’re going to get out there and you’re going to work. And I always joke that the honey-do list hits different when your wife’s country. So whether it’s loading up hay, whether it’s grooming the arena, whether it’s shoveling horse manure, that’s it. I wouldn’t say it humbles me, but it keeps me humble. I think it’s probably the best thing.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 38:17
I enjoy that so much. What have you learned as a leader from your wife?
 
Jemal Singleton 38:22
Oh man, you know just— I gotta talk about grit, like, my wife is a tough cookie. And I told you she’s a saint. She married an Air Force officer turned football coach, so she’s glutton for punishment. One way or the other it was gonna be hard. But no she is such a tough, strong, independent woman, but at the same time, is just an amazing, caring mother, amazing wife, just the things that she does. I joke, she my wife. She drives an F-450 dually. She drives a big Ford truck. She hauls about a 37-foot horse trailer, and she does that, but that ain’t me, that’s her, and she's— Oh, she got a flat on the trailer, pulled on the side of row, put it up, change the tire, boom, and she’s back rolling. So I just love how she has this grit to her, but there’s this amazing, soft and caring side as well, like it’s— and I really, for me, that’s the part that I’m like, I kind of can be like, I can be this tough, physical, strong person. But you know what? I also need to have this other side. I need to have this other piece that I think also helps me allow people in so that those relationships that we talk about happening more. You can’t, you know, like, it can’t be just give, give, give, give, give for them. And I don’t know it’s, it allows me to say, “Hey, I’m hard, I’m strong,” but you know what, I’m also there’s times when I’m weak, sometimes where I can handle those and it’s OK to live in both of those worlds. And that she shows me that every day, just at work, she gets up earlier than me. She’s out there doing the barn chores. She’s feeding the animals. She’s doing all that. We have a petting zoo, so just make sure we understand that I’ve got too many donkeys. I’ve got four goats. We’ve got five horses on our property. And that young lady goes out there and she does all that stuff. And it’s amazing, because she’s building Mallory too— their time at that with her out there and her working and her understanding work ethic and having to go out and do some of those things, clean water tanks, shovel manure, all that stuff. And I love it. Like, I’m blessed to have married the woman that I’ve married, and we’ve been going strong since right after, really right after graduation, until now. So it’s been a really cool ride. And to have a rock at home like that is huge with what I do.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 40:37
Especially since you’re investing in your team. You’re investing in your family. How do you invest in you?
 
Jemal Singleton 40:45
You know, hobbies like other there’s some things I don’t get to do a lot of them, a whole lot, but I do get it to do it every now and then. And for me, one of the great things that clears my mind is fly fishing. You know, getting out on a river, being in a mountain stream and just taking deep breaths and just being thankful to God, of all the blessings that I have, and all the things good and bad that have happened in my life. But it’s those moments, you know, it’s that— and, you know, even my drive home like I use those 30 minutes to transition from kind of my mindset, tough day at work, bad, some things didn't go well, or a loss, driving home after the end of the game, after a loss, it’s like, OK, use that time to just relax, just recover. And you walk into an 11-year-old and all she wants to do is see her dad. It’s like, that stuff kind of goes away pretty quick. So that’s it, you know, family. And maybe getting on a stream every now and then, is the way to do it.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 41:42
I love that. And in those moments of kind of just— is it music? Is it silence?
 
Jemal Singleton 41:48
No, I’m a music guy. There’s not there. I don’t do anything without music. I do barn chores with music. I do it is that what’s on your plate? And, you know, I’ve gotten really big.
 
Naviere Walkewicz
What’s on your playlist?
 
Jemal Singleton
I mean, obviously Christian music is big, gospel. There’s Christian hip hop that I’m a really big fan of,  because I still get the beat — I’m kind of a hip hop child when I was born — but with a positive message. So it’s, you know, I try to feed my soul, you know, just the same way I feed my body with positive music and that. And it helps. Great film watching it. I’ve either got my ear pods in or I’ve got music playing, no matter where I’m at, what I'm doing. So it’s, it is. It is being able to do that and kind of connect in those moments?
 
Naviere Walkewicz 42:30
Well, I wonder if this might be the answer based off of what you just shared about kind of investing in yourself. But what is something you do every day to be a better leader?
 
Jemal Singleton 42:41
So I have a process. And I think everybody needs to have a daily process. So for me, it’s wake up. The first thing I do is I always do a 365-day Bible reading. So it’s just boom, that gives me something just to start the day. And it’s that. And so usually, boom, I read that, and then I’ll get in the car, and I’m listening to worship music as I’m going to work, I’m prepping myself for work. And then my workout. So I’m going to work out, I’m going to lift, I’m going to do whatever can just physically for that, and kind of do some self-help, and I do that in the morning, and then it’s locking time for work. But I think those little consistent behaviors— and it’s always that it’s the things that you can do consistently over time, not, hey, bunch this out and don’t do it. It’s consistently. So I have no excuse. Every single day I can wake up read the Word and that sets me into the path of my habits that I’ve established. So for me, that’s the piece I have. Something consistent. Is it flexible? Yes. Can I take my phone and be on the road and still read? Yes. Can I be in the car and listen to it on the radio? Yes, I can do all that stuff. But I think as leaderships us, having our self-routines for ourselves allows us to be prepared. And I think the just physical nature of it being healthy, trying to, you know, eat right, all the little things, just to be the best that you can be. I have an active job, so I want to try and move around at least a little bit. There is a coaching rule, don’t ever demonstrate anything full speed, because you’re old and you’re going to hurt something. But I want to be in a position to where I can, at least, you know, get out there, move around and run, and that’s part of it, you know, the leadership. See, I’m sweating this practice as much, not as much as players, but like the players, so they at least see that I'm invested. And I think that just having that daily routine is something I think when you listen to most leaders speak, they say that all the time, there's a common theme, and I’ve stolen that from some of the leaders I’ve read about and watched as well.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 44:36
So when you think about yourself and your growth as a leader, I mean, you’ve hit the pinnacle of leading the Super Bowl-winning team. What’s next for you?
 
Jemal Singleton 44:48
Well, just as losing a Super Bowl is one of the worst things I think I’ve ever felt in my profession, winning a Super Bowl is the greatest thing I’ve ever felt in my profession. And unbelievable, and it’s all what it’s cracked up to be. We had a parade here in Philly. You want to talk about unbelievable? I still— I’ve never seen that many people in one place. And you’re— it was five and a half hours of just the most amazing celebration. People all over— we go to the Rocky steps, and you’re looking, I can’t see where the people end, like there’s a sea of people, and it’s like, I kind of want that every year for the rest of my life. That’s what I want. And it’s like, you get that experience, and it’s like, OK, this is what OK in my profession, with the role I’m playing right now, that's success, and it feels good and it’s awesome, and you see what it does to players and how their involvement and their winning, and you understand how hard that is to do. I mean, there’s guys that have spent their entire careers and never even gone to a Super Bowl, so the fact that I’ve been able to go to two and the fact that I was part of a winning team, one is unbelievable, but that’s what I don’t want the other years, like every other year that I’ve ever coached football, I don’t want those. I want last year and I want it to start over. So it’s really— that mindset is “OK, well, what do I have to do better? What did we do that we can get better at?” And it’s really that attention to detail, nonstop, because you know what it takes. You’ve done it. You know what it takes to get to that point. Well, the problem is, what it took last year is not the same as what it’s going to take this year. So it’s the motivation of, I want to strive for that. And you look at some of the greats, you know, put Belichick in that with his wins, you know, Lombardi, you know, just those guys— even Saban in college that have won multiple national championships. I get it now I get where the drive comes. Because it’s what you want every like I want to every off season. I want to be walking around, hey, Super Bowl winning team, yeah, for sure. And but that’s it, like, that’s once you get a taste of that, it’s addictive. It truly is. It’s, it’s that success piece of going about it, but there’s some foundational things that you have to do in order to do that. And you know, hopefully we can go again, and hopefully we can work, but it’s going to take a whole new effort, a whole new game plan, a whole new everything, because what we did last year doesn’t matter anymore.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 47:17
Wow. So what advice would you give to leaders for what they should do today so that they might achieve something greater tomorrow or down the road?
 
Jemal Singleton 47:27
I think. And even for me, because it’s I’m in a kind of a position coach. I’m not the head coach, those types of things. I think the biggest thing that you can do is lead where you’re at, and it doesn't matter where you’re at. “Oh, well, I’m not the CEO,” or “Oh, I'm not the head coach,” or “Oh, I'm not the commander.” So? The leadership comes in a million different ways, and I truly believe that you know kind of what you do with the little things, is how you do everything. And if, in your position, whatever it may be — maybe nobody even works for you — you can still lead from that position. You can lead from that spot. And I think that’s it. Don't be afraid to step out. Don’t be afraid to be a leader in your own mind. It’s got to start there at some point. You keep honing those skills and then maybe you are going to grow. And then, hey, now you have three people working for you, but then now be a leader at that point. And it’s kind of like what I mentioned earlier about be where your feet are. Well, lead where your feet are at. You know, when I go home, lead, and that comes in a different way than when I’m at work, lead. Well, whatever position you’re in, lead. And there’s by example, lead by work, lead by motivation, however it is, there’s no excuse. You can you can lead from any position, any spot that you’re in. So start, if you haven’t start, it’s getting reps. You’re getting leadership reps every time you step out there, and those reps are only going to build the leader that you'll be later down the road.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 48:51
Amazing. Well, we're going to ask Jemal for his final thoughts here next but before we do, I’d like to take a moment and thank you for listening to Long Blue Leadership. The podcast publishes Tuesdays in both video and audio, and is available on all your favorite podcast platforms. Be sure to watch, listen and subscribe to all episodes of Long Blue Leadership at longbluleadership.org. So Jemal, this is such an important moment for us, because I think everyone’s hanging on to you know, what are the final things you want to share with our listeners? Is there anything else that you want to make want to make sure that they kind of ingest and take back from our time together today?
 
Jemal Singleton 49:27
You know, I think you could probably hear in my voice just what the Academy means to me. I mean, the Air Force Academy is, honestly, to this day, why I’m able to sit here. It’s why I was part of a Super Bowl-winning team. It’s why I coach in the NFL. It’s why I have a good family life. It’s what— I mean, there’s so many things that that really relate back to what I did at the Air Force Academy, and that was really the main start, and then even in the military afterwards, some of the lessons that I learned there, and I do think for the Academy, I think just intercollegiate, the athletic programs, like those things are huge. And I think when we’re trying to build these leaders that are going to fight our wars, that are going to be part of that and go, the leadership that they can learn on an athletic field is huge. And just those— the closest thing, I think anybody— for me, closest thing in the battle I had ever gotten to was on a field. I mean, just the physical nature, whether it’s the mat, the court, the field, we’re seeing the role that athletics plays in the development of leadership. And there’s so many great people that have played sports going through. But it is such a great part of building young men and young women in the way. So I’m a huge supporter of Air Force athletics with what they do. I think it’s a big part of leadership training. And then when you combine that piece with what the Academy offers and the different lessons— they’ll stick you in a tube in the dirt and let you learn how to get out of that, right? It’s unbelievable. They’ll let you almost drown in that. But no, but those lessons when if you take any piece away, of my time at the Academy, you take any piece away, the product is different. And I think every piece is so vital, the education piece, the academic piece, that you kind of work, and that’s important. You know, the military training. Ironing your bed. It’s important. I don't make my bed ever. My wife knows I’m not making the bed, but all those little pieces are important. It’s the recipe for success, for leadership, and if you take out this ingredient, you’re not getting the same price. It’s not going to taste the same. And I think that’s the pieces. The Academy is a phenomenal place. Every little pillar that's built on there is extremely important.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 51:45
Well, this has been incredible. I can’t believe 25 years flew by, but you’re still inspiring me today. Jemal, this has been a pleasure, and I want to thank you for being on Long Blue Leadership.
 
Jemal Singleton 51:55
Oh, the pleasure is all mine. Great, great honor. And I said, we've come a long way from those yellow caps.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 51:59
Yes we have, yes we have. And I’d also like to extend a very special thanks to Stacy Kelleher, John Paul Beatty, Alex Barson, Wes Lauria and Haley McCullough, the team here who provided such amazing support for our production and studio space. I’m Naviere Walkewicz; this is Long Blue Leadership. Until next time, thank you for joining us for this edition of Long Blue Leadership. The podcast drops every two weeks on Tuesdays and is available on all your favorite podcast apps. Send your comments and guest ideas to us at socialmedia@usafa.org, and listen to past episodes at longblueleadership.org.
 
KEYWORDS
Leadership, Air Force Academy, coaching, Super Bowl, mentorship, personal growth, military influence, sports, resilience, career decisions, leadership, success, failure, motivation, personal growth, relationships, coaching, NFL, family, grit
 
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association & Foundation
 
 
 

From A-10 combat missions to three Super Bowl championships, Chad Hennings has led in the air, on the field, and now—through character-based leadership.

In this edition of Long Blue Leadership, host Naviere Walkewicz ’99 talks with Emma Przybyslawski ’10, an Air Force Academy graduate whose path has taken her from the front lines of tactical special operations in combat zones to the founder’s chair at Strike Solutions.
SUMMARYWith 1,634 confirmed kills, and personal threats from ISIS, Emma knows what high-stakes leadership looks like.
She opened up about her transition to the tech world, the power of the Air Force Academy network, and the role that courage, flexibility, and humor play in both survival and success. Whether you're in uniform or in a startup, Emma’s insights on active listening and continual growth are essential to your success as a developing or seasoned leader.
 
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EMMA'S 10 BEST LEADERSHIP TAKEAWAYS
 - Leadership requires courage and action - Course correction is a leadership strength - Ownership is the price of admission to elite teams - Active listening builds trust and influence - Feedback isn’t personal—it’s growth fuel - You can lead from any seat - Clarity of standards drives excellence - Mission over ego - Diversity demands curiosity, not assumptions - Leaders multiply leadership
 
CHAPTERS
00:00 Introduction to Emma Prisboslawski's Journey01:26 Life in Special Operations07:02 Navigating Chaos: A Day in Emma's Life10:40 The Academy Experience: A Personal Journey18:04 Leadership Lessons from Military Experience27:52 The Importance of Active Listening in Leadership28:21 The Power of Listening and Empathy29:51 Navigating Career Transitions32:18 Embracing Technology and Innovation35:55 The Importance of Networking36:24 Building Strike Solutions37:48 Navigating the Vast Tech Landscape40:14 Learning from Mistakes42:31 Giving Back to the Academy46:31 Continuous Self-Improvement and Leadership
 
ABOUT EMMA
BIO
Emma Przybyslawski ’10 is the daughter of Mj. Gen. (Ret.) Anthony '76 and Priscilla Pzybyslawski. She spent her childhood counting the number of states she lived in as a military brat. While at the Academy, she loved living in Cadet Squadron 19 and eventually led the Wolverines as Squadron Commander to Outstanding Squadron of the Year. Upon graduation, Emma was commissioned as a special operations intelligence officer and spent her Air Force career either overseas supporting counterdrug efforts or counterterrorism operations in the Middle East; she was awarded a Bronze Star during her last deployment for her combat efforts in Iraq. She decided to separate from the Air Force in 2016 and started her civilian career in the high-tech industry. Emma has since founded Strike Solutions, a defense company focused on bringing advanced technology solutions to various DoD operational mission sets. In her free time, she has a passion for traveling, food, spending time with family and friends, and sports – but all of those things are best enjoyed with her husband and Air Force pilot Chris Spach and their Bernese Mountain Dogs, Gunner and Harley.
 
CONNECT WITH EMMA
LINKEDIN  |  STRIKE SOLUTIONS
 
 
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AVAILABLE ON ALL MAJOR PODCAST PLATFORMS
 
 
TRANSCRIPT
OUR SPEAKERSGUEST:  Emma Przybyslawski ’10  |  HOST:  Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99 
 
KEYWORDS
leadership, resilience, military, special operations, personal growth, Air Force Academy, women in combat, entrepreneurship, active listening, mentorship, leadership, empathy, career transition, technology, networking, innovation, military, Air Force Academy, personal growth, mentorship
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association & Foundation
 
 

A view of leadership and character development through the eyes and actions of a world-class athlete.
SUMMARY
For NCAA Division I heavyweight wrestling champion and newly commissioned 2nd Lt. Wyatt Hendrickson ’24, what happens on the mat informs how he manages conflict, planning, strategy and tactics, and most importantly, his development as a leader.
 
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WYATT'S TAKEAWAYS
 - Wyatt's journey exemplifies leadership and perseverance.
 - The Air Force Academy provided a strong foundation for Wyatt.
 - Pivotal moments can change the trajectory of one's life.
 - Tattoos can tell a personal story and hold deep meaning.
 - Winning the NCAA title was a culmination of hard work and strategy.
  - Mindset and planning are crucial in wrestling and leadership.
 - Family support plays a significant role in personal success.
 - Mastering the basics is essential for excellence in any field.
 - Call signs reflect identity and values in the military.
 - God's plan often unfolds in unexpected ways.  Adversity can lead to personal growth and resilience.
 - Mental strength is crucial in competitive sports.
 - Reaching out for help is essential for overcoming challenges.
 - Building a strong foundation in skills is vital for success.
 - Wrestling teaches valuable life lessons about failure and perseverance.
 - Enjoying the journey is as important as achieving goals.
 - Hard work is the only path to success; there are no shortcuts.
 - Self-motivation is key to personal and professional growth.
 - Doing little things right builds good habits and character.
 - Faith and gratitude play a significant role in success.
 
CHAPTERS
00:00:  Introduction to Leadership and Perseverance
02:07:  The Journey to the Air Force Academy
05:56:  Defining Moments and Personal Growth
09:57:  Tattoos and Their Significance
14:03:  The NCAA Championship Experience
18:03:  Mindset and Training in Wrestling
22:05:  Call Signs and Identity
26:00:  Family Background and Support
27:06:  Overcoming Adversity in Wrestling
30:40:  The Mental Game of Wrestling
35:15:  Building a Strong Foundation
38:01:  Lessons from Wrestling and Military
40:34:  Training for the 2028 Olympics
42:08:  Finding Joy in the Journey
44:42:  Navigating Sponsorships and NIL
47:03:  The Importance of Doing Little Things Right
50:48:  Self-Motivation and Purpose
54:02:  Closing Thoughts and Gratitude
 
 
ABOUT WYATT HENDRICKSON
BIO
2nd Lt. Wyatt Hendrickson ’24 is a wrestler known for his remarkable collegiate career and service in the United States Air Force. He gained national attention in 2025 by winning the NCAA heavyweight championship, defeating Olympic gold medalist Gable Steveson in a dramatic upset.
Early Life and High School Career
Hendrickson comes from Newton, Kansas, and is the son of Todd and Lynnette Hendrickson. At Newton High School, he was a standout wrestler, becoming a two-time Kansas state champion and a three-time finalist. He earned All-American honors in freestyle, Greco-Roman, and folkstyle wrestling, and won national titles at the NHSCA Senior Nationals and FloNationals. 
Collegiate Wrestling Career
Air Force Academy
Initially hesitant about a military path, Wyatt was persuaded by his father to attend the U.S. Air Force Academy. There, he became one of the most dominant heavyweight wrestlers in NCAA history. He was a five-time NCAA qualifier, two-time Big 12 champion, and two-time NCAA All-American, finishing third nationally in both 2023 and 2024. He led the nation in pins for three consecutive seasons and was twice named the NCAA Most Dominant Wrestler. He concluded his Air Force career with a 103–11 record, becoming the program’s all-time leader in pins.​
Oklahoma State University
Due to the COVID-19 pandemic, Wyatt had an extra year of eligibility. As a member of the Air Force’s World Class Athlete Program, he was allowed to delay active-duty service to pursue Olympic training. This enabled him to transfer to Oklahoma State University for the 2024–25 season. Fulfilling a childhood dream, he joined the Cowboys and went undefeated (27–0), culminating in his victory over Gable Steveson in the NCAA finals.
Personal Life and Military Service
Wyatt holds the rank of second lieutenant in the U.S. Air Force and is pursuing an MBA at Oklahoma State University. His unique journey from a small-town Kansas wrestler to NCAA champion and military officer exemplifies dedication and perseverance.​
MORE ON WYATT HERE:
 
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FULL TRANSCRIPT
SPEAKERS:  Guest, 2nd. Lt. Wyatt Hendrickson ’24  |  Host, Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99
 
 
 
 
 
 
KEYWORDS
Leadership, perseverance, Air Force Academy, wrestling, NCAA champion, personal growth, mindset, tattoos, family support, call signs, wrestling, adversity, mental strength, Olympic training, leadership, self-improvement, Air Force Academy, sponsorships, NIL (Name, Image, Likeness), personal growth
 
GALLERY
 
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association & Foundation
 
 

Jake DeRuyter, a 2015 Air Force Academy graduate, shares a compelling leadership journey marked by unexpected challenges and resilient adaptation.

In this episode of Long Blue Leadership, Christian Evans shares his journey from a jovial cadet to a dedicated leader focused on uplifting others.
SUMMARY
Christian reflects on transformative experiences during his time at the Air Force Academy, the importance of mentorship, and the impact of community engagement. Christian discusses navigating career transitions, the power of giving back, and the significance of leading with love. He emphasizes resilience, personal growth, and the need to engage the next generation of leaders.
 
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TAKEAWAYS
Christian emphasizes the importance of humor in leadership.
Transformative experiences can lead to personal growth and leadership development.
Mentorship plays a crucial role in guiding younger generations.
Navigating career transitions requires building a supportive network.
Giving back to the community enhances personal fulfillment.
Engaging the next generation is vital for sustaining leadership values.
Resilience is key to overcoming failures and learning from them.
Leading with love fosters a supportive environment.
Personal growth is a continuous journey influenced by experiences.
Finding avenues to contribute to the community is essential for leadership.
 
EPISODE CHAPTERS
00:00  Introduction to Leadership Journeys
02:56  Transformative Experiences in Cadet Life
06:10  The Impact of Mentorship and Community
08:52  Navigating Career Transitions
11:49  The Power of Giving Back
14:50  Engaging the Next Generation
17:55  Lessons in Resilience and Growth
21:00  Leading with Love
23:55  Reflections on Personal Growth
26:59  Conclusion and Future Aspirations
 
ABOUT CHRISTIAN EVANS
BIO
Christian Evans is a Business Development Executive at Olsson where he leads sales and growth efforts in Texas and Colorado. Christian previously worked as Managing Partner of Greenwood Capital lower middle market PE firm, Wealth Advisor at Morgan Stanley, Capital Markets Sales Manager at Highland Capital Management. Prior to joining Highland, he worked as an associate on the Banking, Investing, and Lending team at Goldman Sachs. Christian started his professional career in the United States Air Force as a space operations officer at Cape Cod AFS, MA and an acquisitions program manager at the Space and Missile Systems Center at Los Angeles AFB, CA.
Christian is an active leader in the Dallas community sitting on the Visiting Nurses Association of Texas Board of Directors on the finance and development committees and on the Friends Barack Obama Male Leadership Academy on the Development committee. Christian is an active member of the Urban Land Institute and The Real Estate Council.
Christian is a 2008 Graduate of the United States Air Force Academy where he majored in Management. As a Cadet, he competed on the Fighting Falcon football team, served as President of the Tuskegee Airmen Club, and became a member of Kappa Alpha Psi Incorporated. He completed his MBA at the SMU Cox School of Business in 2017. Christian is married to Dr. Candace Evans and they enjoy their time with their son, Cash.
- Copy courtesy of the U.S. Air Force Academy Association of Graduates 
 
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FULL TRANSCRIPT
SPEAKERS
Guest:    CHRISTIAN EVANS ’08  |  Host:  Lt. Col. (Ret.) Naviere Walkewicz ’99
 
Naviere Walkewicz  00:00
Welcome to Long Blue Leadership, the podcast where we share insights on leadership through the lives and experiences of Air Force Academy graduates. I'm Naviere Walkewicz, Class of ’99. For Christian Evans, USAFA Class of 2008, the journey was arduous, and even now, though he's dedicated himself to a life of lifting others up, he still thinks of himself as a work in progress, becoming the model for grace, giving back and leadership that he is today. Christian, thanks for being here today.
 
Christian Evans  00:28
Thank you so much for having me. Truly honored and flattered to be here.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  00:34
What were you like growing up? — I guess maybe is the first question.
 
Christian Evans  00:38
I've always been a jovial person. I've always had a sense of humor, and I've always kind of been a strategic thinker, if that makes sense. So, while I was somewhat the life of the party to a certain extent, or someone on the team that would galvanize the teammates, it was mostly through humor or engaging outside of anything serious, because everything's so serious, right?
 
Naviere Walkewicz
Right.
 
Christian Evans 
So, growing up and even at the Academy, I always kind of used humor as a way to put myself out there, so to speak, right? To kind of get people's moods to calm down. Yeah, I just always was more focused on what I was doing, and never focused on “I should be leading in this space,” outside of just knowing if you do well in school, get good grades… All right, that's leadership by doing. “I'm in NHS, I'm in the Fellowship of Christian Athletes. I'm doing all these service things. And even though I'm not the president or vice president, I'm still active, serving a greater purpose.” So, yeah, growing up, I was a good kid, liked to have fun, maybe a little crass at times.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  02:05
Your sophomore year, you know, your three-degree, you kind of had this decision point. What was it that helped you make that decision? Was there an incident? Was there a moment? Was it just a path you were on?
 
Christian Evans  02:20
There was definitely an incident. At the end of our sophomore year, we did not have the season that we wanted as a football team, so the night of the game, after the game, I was still underaged, and I drank alcohol and the Academy found out about it. And so, I had to go through that rehabilitation process, which wasn't fun. I think it was six months where you're restricted to the base. At that point, that's when I said, “OK, this isn't a civilian school. You’ve kind of got to button it up here if you want to stay and actually get something out of it.” So that next year, I made a point during summer school, and even that summer as a cadre for basic, to just really apply myself and try to see, “All right, if I actually apply myself and lead and maybe not make everything a joke, will you see real outcomes?” And I think that's where my first experience of really being able to affect younger cadets and/or younger grads and their experience with the Academy. Because as a basic cadet cadre, I really went out of my way to try to look out for our basics in a way that typically doesn't happen during basic training. And it is what it is, right? Basic training is not summer camp, so it's got to be tough, it's got to be hard. But I definitely — and I think if you ask my basics — I definitely went into the situation with the idea of making it hard, but fair, but also making it enjoyable and something that's worth remembering. And so experiencing that as a cadet and really seeing, “OK, yeah, you're pretty good at this thing, you can motivate people, and you can make them feel good about themselves, and you could help them when they need it, and not make it hard for them to get where they need to go, kind of thing, and really enable them.” That was a great experience for me, and kind of carried into the next year. I got on group staff; I learned that the more that you lean in, there are actual outcomes that come out of it, and you're able to have a positive impact on other people, which, to me, gives me — that's where I get energy, and I feel good about myself. Outside of how I feel about myself is how I can help other people to accomplish whatever it is they kind of want to do.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  05:04
Wow, it sounds like you took an incident that happened to you all the way back in basic and you found a way to turn it around, to make sure that another basic didn't have to go through what you did. And you probably didn't even realize it at the time when you're going through that self-discovery as a leader and applying yourself, but can you think of a story of where that came into play? Like when you were a cadre for a basic, was there ever a time where you were able to make a difference for a basic that you weren't able to have made for you?
 
Christian Evans  05:34
Absolutely. One of the things I did — and this is an easy one — was when there was someone that needed meal replacements for whatever reason, or was still hungry at the end of the day, I would help get food and sustenance to them, whether they played sports or not. Obviously doing it for the football guys so that they could maintain weight for when the season starts. But when other non-football people mentioned that they were still hungry, the food was making them upset, things like that. Yeah, I would get them what they needed, right? And I think for that, they felt like somebody cared. I will say, as a cadre, I think the best thing I could have done was just make it a memorable experience through the experiences, right? Like I said, I'm into humor. I like to have fun, and to me, basic training as a cadre was like being a stand-up comedian with the built-in audience, you know? So, I would do bits with the kids, not kids, but they were kids. I would do bits, you know? I would have fun, but within that, it would always be kind of a bigger picture.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  06:49
Well, I think that's fantastic sharing a bit of your personality, and I think that's also part of leadership, because when we think about what how people lead, it's usually from what they learn from others. So, being able to see that you can be human, and you can use humor, and you can still affect a mission, and especially — maybe people bring in their best self, because they didn't feel that they had to be so fearful, right? I don't know, maybe you touched them in that way.
 
Christian Evans  07:17
I hope so. Because there was still a lot of fear, I imagine, left in the basic squadron.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  07:24
Yes. Well, it led me to something you we talked about because you said you had indifference even your senior years. But there was a theme through that as well. You talked about being able to help others, so maybe talk through what you've learned about yourself as a leader in this space of helping others. Has there been a moment in your career now, whether through in the military, or when you transitioned out, where you saw that coming into play more?
 
Christian Evans  07:49
It's something that I feel is evergreen, for me, is I'm always kind of thinking about, “How can I have an impact on the community around me?” Most recently, since transitioning from active duty into the private sector, I learned a lot. I didn't know much about the industry I was going into that being finance, I was blessed with an opportunity to do an internship with Goldman Sachs during my transition period, while I was still active duty. This was before they had the program they have now, the skill bridge program. I went into a very complex situation with very little information, and going through that process, I was able to reach out to a lot of people to help fill the gap. No. 1, most of the people that I found myself talking to and that had built networks within Goldman and other financial institutions were Navy and overwhelmingly Army grads. So, at that point, and I like that it says Long Blue Leadership, because the Long Blue Line is what we were all sold on coming here, whether you played sports or not, Just about anybody you asked that have made the transition from active duty into a new industry or career that requires a little bit of advocacy and understanding, and people doing some recruiting and all those things — how much it means to have somebody that you could call and learn things that you just don't know. My transition, learning the industry, learning the different steps that you need to take to get to different parts of the industry — I started just documenting resources, built out my network so the people that had helped me and kind of poured into me and mentored me, tried to stay in touch. That is something that I'm pretty good at, is just meeting people and turning a casual introduction into some type of meaningful relationship. And so, when I got a few years in and did my MBA, and kind of went through my process, I put together a one-pager, two-pager, and shared it with the number of younger grads at the time that I kind of adopted as mentees. They were just young grads, or young cadets, in some cases, that had an ambition and that wanted to do something that they didn't really know much about. Being able to give them that information to fill the void earlier in the process — maybe they've got a few years left in the Air Force. OK, they could start preparing themselves through certain things, getting involved in certain organizations. I thought if I could get this information to them earlier, well they could start preparing more for making that transition. And so, after doing that, and over the years, they made it their own thing, and now they have matriculated to some of the top business schools, law schools in America. And so, for me, that showed me the power of “when you learn, teach; when you get, give,” right? I heard that quote a number of years ago. That kind of was something that, after doing that and seeing the outcome, and especially now when I look back, that started maybe, let's say, eight years ago. Well now guys are starting their own funds, and they're working at multiple investment banks and consulting companies, and to me, that was more rewarding than even the accomplishments I had made in my transition. So, I feel very blessed to have been able to do that. But, you know, I definitely, over the time, have made it a mission of mine to ensure that I'm pulling the younger grads in the direction that they want to go, and doing it a little bit earlier in the cycle so that they could get better prepared.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  12:25
This is really fascinating. What makes you care in this way?
 
Christian Evans  12:29
At my first base was my first real interaction with the AOG and actual alumni. I got to meet real grads. One in particular was a gentleman, Al Fullerton. I think he was a 1963 grad, and he was medically discharged before he was able to serve. However, he was a grad, and he stayed connected to the organization. And my buddy, Evan Dadoski, who — he would get us to those AOG meetings, and when I and when I had those experiences and when I had the experience with Al, and he would give his time to me, Evan, Brian Campbell, Adam Hood, like go have lunch with us. Got to meet with Flash Wiley while I was up there, you know, Nate Dial went and got his master’s while he was up there. And we would go have coffee and get to talk to him and interact with him. And I said, “Man, there is some richness to this,” but those were just really individual connection points. It wasn't like a critical mass, but it did pique my interest in saying, “Oh, there is a richness in a younger grad getting to know a more seasoned grad, or the intergenerational interactions that a lot of times we don't get for whatever reason.”
 
Naviere Walkewicz  13:57
So, you started seeing and feeling the effects of the Long Blue Line?
 
Christian Evans  14:01
Yeah, absolutely. It was really just the thought of trying to maximize the talent that God gave me, and in doing that, you can't be indifferent and be a great leader. You can't be indifferent and be the best that you can be.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  14:19
Certainly, doesn't hurt to be kind of engaging with the vision for where our association’s going and to your point, what does your impact look like within there?
 
Christian Evans 
Sure.
 
Naviere Walkewicz 
So, what has that look like, and how has that shaped you as a leader? Do you feel like those are one in the same, like you bring your leadership to it in the way that you are, or has it changed you this kind of service as a leader?
 
Christian Evans  14:43
Yeah, if anything, I learned that if you do have a passion for how things should be, if you lean in, you galvanize the troops, so to speak, and/or try to find leadership opportunities within the multiple organizations that interact and do things for a cadet. And for grads, find those because it's been very beneficial to me as I have come onto the board and seeing, OK, something like the next generation.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  15:12
So, can you talk a little bit more about this Next Gen group?
 
Christian Evans  15:16
Yeah, absolutely. There are certain periods as graduates, where we have big decisions to make, and as an association, the more that we're engaged and helping you to solve for those decision problems, so to speak, the more you'll feel the value was served to you to engage. So, that kind of spurred a conversation with Nate Dial. And, you know, we always kind of have strategy sessions here and there about all kinds of stuff. But in this situation, it was, “Hey, how can we kind of solve for this young alumni or emerging leader alumni engagement?” Because the numbers speak for themselves — it's extremely low. If all grads are engaging at 10%, if you graduated after ’95 it's less than 10%. So, Next Gen kind of was born out of that. And so, we started thinking about, “We've still got a lot of people engaged from our previous classes.” And so, I thought if we created some type of working group to start thinking about what can we do to provide this value proposition to that demographic of graduates that are historically disengaged? And engagement is not money, right? It's just showing up to alumni events or coming back to the Academy at any point or whatever, going to a game when the Academy is playing close to you, things of that nature. So that's where we got to the Next Gen. group.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  16:54
I mean, I think a theme that's been woven through this with you has been, in your journey as a leader, really leaning in. You know, it seems like when you've had these moments of decisions, of applying yourself, you have these continuous wins that seem to have continued to fuel that desire to make further impact and others. Would you say that's accurate?
 
Christian Evans  17:20
Absolutely. You know, wins have a way of building on themselves, and losses due too. So, incremental big win, small wins — I'm just trying to win. So yeah, to me… and even in the face of a loss, you're still winning, because it's an opportunity to learn, right? I'm sure it's a common theme, but it's true. We all have experienced failure. Nobody wants to talk about it, but everybody experiences it some way. How do you deal with that failure? We talk about resiliency at the Academy, you know? We talk about integrity a lot. We talk about service, we talk about excellence, but we don't talk about failure necessarily, because we're Academy grads. We don't fail, right? We don't fail. But it's true: Even in failure, you're it's an opportunity to win, and the more wins you kind of put together. They cascade, and they grow into great things. And that's kind of where I see, at least my growth and development has been through just a cascading of small, big, intermediate and honestly, putting myself out, taking myself out of my comfort zone, see where the chips fall.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  18:44
Well, we'd like to hear what your leadership lessons and takeaways are, because there have been really a lot of moments in here that I think everyone has been able to kind of see themselves in, right? You've had moments where you've had to kind of pick yourself up, even when you weren't sure what that looked like, and you did. What, what might you leave with our folks?
 
Christian Evans  19:04
You know, we go through a lot of leadership training, so it's like a leadership podcast to teach me what I've been training for, for it feels like our whole adult life could seem redundant sometimes. So, I'm not going to give anybody a nugget that they might not have heard before, but something that I've tried to do that maybe, when I think about leadership, has helped me to approach it in a different way, is to always think about leading with love to a certain extent. I don't mean that to be mushy, I mean that to be sincere. Always go into a situation thinking about the person you're dealing with, as opposed to yourself. Little things like I said, we've got a lot of technical and structured education about what leadership is, but how do you actually execute and effectively live it? So for me, it's a very selfless kind of approach. But I always say, “Lead with love,” and that's what I'll continue to do, right? But I don't have any groundbreaking nuggets. I don't think about leadership all the time. It's just in me, right? I think it's in all — most — of us, they made sure of that. But sincerely, leading with love, because there are other obvious nuances and principles to leadership, but to me, that's the one that gets lost the most in translation, sometimes.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  20:40
Can you share a moment when you led with love and it was maybe a moment where you wouldn't have expected that's the way that you could actually solve something?
 
Christian Evans  20:53
I wouldn't say I have a specific instance. It's just who I am. So, I don't really have an instance. I think every time that I get the opportunity to be in a leadership situation that's at work, in my day job, that leadership looks a little different than leadership in an AOG board capacity, or leadership in other board service that I do around the town of Dallas, or really leadership within your own peer groups, right? It's just a part of who I am. So I don't necessarily have a specific situation. It's just most of the situations where I found myself having an opportunity to actively lead other people, I try to make sure that I'm implementing that, and I think most people that have gotten to work with me would attest to it.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  21:57
Well, I can validate that certainly. Just in our interactions together, I think I've seen you lead with love, and it's because you put the human aspect in. How can I help you? — is really how it translates across, and I think that's very powerful. It's maybe not something that people think about, but it's probably highly effective. But even more so, it's incredibly, probably fulfilling.
 
Christian Evans  22:19
Yeah, I would say one thing I learned is, I don't need much help. I'm gonna go figure it out. But there's a lot of people that don't have that same personality type, and so I think that's important when they don't, is that you can be somewhat of a force multiplier for them, using Air Force speak.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  22:39
I think it's wonderful what you're leading and you're passionate about, and it, again, dovetails from, I think, all of your experiences, of always wanting to make something better than what you had had to go through or experienced in life.
 
Christian Evans  22:50
You had told me to repeat this, but I had said if you would have asked just about anybody that knew me as a cadet and young officer, if Chris Evans — because I didn't become Christian until I came as a civilian, and everybody's Chris — but yeah, Chris Evans is on the AOG board. They'd say, “No way, no way.” So, I think the Academy, we've all had our experience with maybe getting broken down, whether it's basic training, whether it's your first year, academics. I would say, it started for me during basic training. Growing up and coming into the Academy, I thought of myself as a pretty good kid. You know, I focused on school first, athletics second, and I had a lot of success in those two spaces. I was blessed to be recruited to the Academy to play football. However, I did have a little intellectual curiosity about what the place was all about. Coming on my recruiting visit, seeing the training going on, it definitely piqued my interest. But when I got here and went through the Prep School first, I actually somewhat enjoyed that experience. Basic training at the prep school was hard, but it definitely tests your mettle. And after maybe that first few weeks and thinking that I might quit, having a few conversations with people back home, definitely made the decision that I came here for a reason I was going to see it through. That was challenging next year, during basic training, matriculating into our first — or four-degree year, and I had a very catastrophic event happened with my family where my grandfather was tragically murdered by my uncle — I mean, to be transparent. When we were preparing for this, you mentioned, “Oh, you've gone through some traumas,” and I never really thought about it as a trauma, but it definitely was one. And I would say, through the healing process, I connected with a very great chaplain we had here who took a lot of time to help me heal. However, he could only do so much because I had a lot of work to do for myself. I was blessed to be able to travel and play as a freshman and so in that, between going through what I went through in basic training and then the culture of the football team of somewhat really focusing inward, it definitely helped to lead to a general indifference about maximizing my time at the Academy and focusing on things that may not have been as value add to the bigger picture of being here, if that makes sense. So, from a leadership perspective, in my sophomore year, I had to make a serious decision, like, “If I'm going to stay here, well, what am I here for? Am I going to maximize my time, or am I going to keep goofing off and trying to live like I'm at a civilian school kind of thing?” And so, I did make a conscious effort then to kind of lock in, but still, a young athlete that had a lot of distractions around them, there was still a lot of room to grow. And as I went through my cadet time, I would say, definitely found the beginning of my pride in this institution. Nothing like graduating and have the president call your name, right? That was probably one of the cooler experiences. I would say that was the genesis of my indifference towards the bigger picture of what the Academy represents. But in that, I did come to a few moments where I realized that “Hey, you're really wasting your time here if you're going to continue behaving and really thinking about the Academy from a selfish lens.” That just goes to show it's OK to grow up. The Terrazzo-gap doesn't still have to exist. We could all kind of give back to our organization in ways that we're comfortable with, but you just got to find the avenues to do it.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  27:27
Well, when I think of the Next Gen community, what excites me is I think about the two cadets that I have at the Academy, and it's the Next Gen community that's going to be their mentors when they graduate. So, when you think about that, it really puts it in perspective.
 
Christian Evans  27:41
They’ll also be their commanders too.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  27:43
That's right. Well, Christian, it's been a pleasure having you on Long Blue Leadership. Thank you so much for being here today.
 
Christian Evans  27:49
Thank you again for having me and thank you to the whole team that makes this podcast happen. I know there's a lot of work that goes into it. Thank you for having me.
 
Naviere Walkewicz  28:01
Thank you for joining us for this edition of Long Blue Leadership. The podcast drops every two weeks on Tuesdays and is available on all your favorite podcast apps. Send your comments and guest ideas to us at social media@usafa.org, and listen to past episodes@longblueleadership.org
 
KEYWORDS
Leadership, mentorship, personal growth, Air Force Academy, community impact, resilience, humor in leadership, self-discovery, transition to civilian life, alumni engagement.
 
 
 
The Long Blue Line Podcast Network is presented by the U.S. Air Force Academy Association and Foundation
 
 

The Association of Graduates and Air Force Academy Foundation just dropped a special episode of Long Blue Leadership, featuring our continuing coverage of the 32nd National Character and Leadership Symposium.

In this special episode of Long Blue Leadership, we present our Long Blue Line Podcast Network coverage of National Character and Leadership Symposium 2025.

Dr. Heather Wilson, a 1982 Air Force Academy graduate, formerly the 24th Secretary of the Air Force, and first USAFA graduate to hold the position, discusses her unexpected journey to the role, emphasizing the importance of integrity, service, and leadership.